Mixing: Basic track structure (Dnb)

To all the dnb DJs and producers:

Hello! I've recently pulled out the ol' CDJ's in hopes of gaining some basic mixing skills. I primarily want to spin dnb. I know how to beatmatch, eq etc; however, I'm having some difficulties queuing things up properly. Is there a formula that applies to nearly all dnb tracks (provided the producer made them dnb friendly)?

How does a "DJ friendly track" look like structure-wise?

Is it something like this??

Intro, break etc: 64 bars??
Drop: 64 bars??
breakdown, 2nd buildup: 64 bars???
.....

For instance, If this was the case, you could always start the second track from the beginning right as the playing track drops, using the hihats (every 1/4th) to match initially (which most dnb intros seem to have ).

Or are the number of bars per section all over the place (ie. you must know the track structure beforehand)


thanks in advance!

[Moon]

the basic dnb beat is BOOM (basskick) CHI (SNARE) BOOMCHI - now that is 1 bar

1 "section" is 16 of these bars. alot of dnb tracks have a 2-6 section intro with a beat to mix into the track... then theres a breakdown of 2 sections, then another 4-6 sections of beats.... then another 1-3 section breackdown, then another 4-6 sections of beats...

all tracks are different and the more you play around with different tracks by different producers, the easier you'll find seeing the pattern... its pretty simple.

[C_squared]

Most dance music is structured in 4/4 signature.

Most changes (ie. edits and fills) happen every 16-32 bars.

However w/ drum & bass (edits or switches can vary every 16 bars, then variations of holding that beat for 32 then changing again) It realy depends on the artist's style.

Best thing to do is follow your tunes from the moment you hear the first high-hat. Count the beats to determine how often edits or switches happen.. Do this over and over until you can anticipate the changes throught out the tune. Know your vinyl like the back of your hand.

Always cue on the ONE using the kick drum or high hat. Cherry picking (ie... fast-forwarding a track to find the beat can also be use to cue up for faster mixes)

I hope that was helpful.

Do you guys always strive to achieve the legendary "double drop"?

and one other question. I notice with dnb there are 2 fundamental snare/bd patterns:

x = bd
y = snare

123456789abcdef
x...y.....x.y..

and the other being something like this (snares hitting every 5th & 11th... the most obvious example being DKay - Be there 4 U:)

123456789abcdef
x.x.y.....y....

Are these to generally considered mixable? Ive never tried, but plan on it when i get home tonight.

[C_squared]

double drops are the most overrated thing in drum & bass. It's Andy C's signature thing but A LOT of dj's do it.

All it is timing. Cueing track A at the exact bar meassure that track B begins to breakdown.

It's just like any other mix, but both tracks break simoltanisouly (spelling ) after the breakdown. I can pick you a shit load of tunes in my crate that will double drop when cued proper.

[Moon]

everyone does double drops... andy c is just really good with em. doing alot of double drops are fun and keeps things interesting. you can be really creative with them and and make some sick sounding layers. definetly NOT over rated. doing them live on a big sound system can be challenging alot of the time and when pulled off really tite and the mix just works really well, then it's just sick sick sick.

[decypher]

Yeh double drops can sound really muddy unless u properly EQ the 2 tracks so that each freq range has its own area. Also u better make sure the shit is locked down or when they both drop its gonna be chaos haha..

after awhile u should know exactly when a new phase in the track is coming. But be careful as some producers will throw in a 2 or 4 bar break at the beginning of a new phase, throwing ur mix off if u think that the phase drops after that pause, not before... as carlos said, its all about knowing ur records , being creative, and having fun! :)

[dj_soo]

meh - double drops are overrated in that some people seem to think it's the epitome of dnb mixing - which it definitely isn't (I blame Andy C for his overuse of that technique)

Although that being said, every dnb dj should strive to learn it and at least have it in their aresenal of mixing tricks. Hell, do other DJs do double drops? I rarely hear it when i see breaks djs play (don't really care for house or trance), but it can basically done with any mix-friendly electronic genre.

Me, I prefer the sound of a double-breakdown.

[ebbomega]

Learn to count to 4.

Then do it twice.

Then do that twice.

Then do that twice.

etc.

Regardless of what people may say, Jungle/DnB is still in 4/4 or 4/8 time. The snares are usually on the second beat. Use the rest of the percussion to judge where the on-beat is. Count to 8. Repeat. Line up as such.

[dj_soo]

Originally Posted by ebbomega

Regardless of what people may say, Jungle/DnB is still in 4/4 or 4/8 time.

who's been saying it isn't? All electronic music with the exception of maybe some IDM or more listening-oriented downtempo is pretty much 4/4 although some producers will add an extra bar or two. I actually think they do it just to fuck with the DJ.

I have one track that inexplicably makes the last bar 3/4 every 64 bars or so. It's really annoying to mix...

[ebbomega]

Originally Posted by mofo-x

who's been saying it isn't? All electronic music with the exception of maybe some IDM or more listening-oriented downtempo is pretty much 4/4 although some producers will add an extra bar or two. I actually think they do it just to fuck with the DJ.

I have one track that inexplicably makes the last bar 3/4 every 64 bars or so. It's really annoying to mix...

The number of fly-by-night djs I've heard that proclaim that jungle is 7/8 or 5/4 or something like that would astound you.

[dj_soo]

Originally Posted by ebbomega

The number of fly-by-night djs I've heard that proclaim that jungle is 7/8 or 5/4 or something like that would astound you.

those must be the ones who have no concept of musical theory...

I have actually heard some jungle that is 3/4 or 6/8 - SUV has some cool tracks that is essentially jungle breaks in non-4/4 time (Three by Four on Full Cycle is the only one i can name offhand - starts in 3/4 and transitions to 4/4 at the second drop or something)

Lamb also makes jungle-based tunes in funky time signatures...

[C_squared]

Originally Posted by ebbomega

The number of fly-by-night djs I've heard that proclaim that jungle is 7/8 or 5/4 or something like that would astound you.

dj's from where-- YARROW?!?!?

[dj_soo]

Originally Posted by Junglist

Do you guys always strive to achieve the legendary "double drop"?

and one other question. I notice with dnb there are 2 fundamental snare/bd patterns:

x = bd
y = snare

123456789abcdef
x...y.....x.y..

and the other being something like this (snares hitting every 5th & 11th... the most obvious example being DKay - Be there 4 U:)

123456789abcdef
x.x.y.....y....

Are these to generally considered mixable? Ive never tried, but plan on it when i get home tonight.

all jungle is mixable :)

There are probably like 5 or 6 dominant breaks used in dnb and far more complex rhythms in older school jungle and ragga - but it's all mixable together.

[Filo]

i think you are reading waaay too much into it.. jsut start fuckin around.. line up cue points and start the next song.. you'll eventually learn your tracks better and better and will make it sound better.... goes for mixing all music... people get too bloody technical

[dj_soo]

oh yea - just go vinyl - it's much easier to figure things out just by looking at the record. If you're using CDs, then you're going to have to know your tunes better - but ultimately most dnb is pretty musch as formulaic as any electronic genre

[Wood]

don't concenlate on the fingah, or you will miss aw tha heavenry grory!

[decypher]

lol is sherwood shitfaced?

["jawayo"1]

CSQUARED

yo...i dont knwo who that is on yur avatarbut she is fuckin ReAlly hot......

i hate looking at it...but i also cant stop.....

[NinjaBoy]

Originally Posted by ebbomega

The number of fly-by-night djs I've heard that proclaim that jungle is 7/8 or 5/4 or something like that would astound you.

7/8?

That gives me a head ache even thinking about it.

[C_squared]

Originally Posted by Wood

don't concenlate on the fingah, or you will miss aw tha heavenry grory!

Decoder Ring: Don't concentrate on raising the finger, or you will miss all the heavenly glory!

It's a bit of a fortune cookie if you ask me.

[dj_soo]

Originally Posted by NinjaBoy

7/8?

That gives me a head ache even thinking about it.

Pink Floyd - Money - probably the most famous 7/8 pop song.

Check out some of Lamb's stuff too - it uses a lot of funky signatures and time changes in their songs while utilizing a lot of electronic producation methods.

[ppcock]

holy shit.. you people are confusing.

Learn your tracks, even when you dont feel like spinning, play them anyways.

I wouldnt go buy any "formula" I master every track i own. Sometimes you could be playing a drop happens on the 28th beat instead of the 32. Which pretty much fucks up your mix if you're going by formulas. And say you get bored with dnb, switch to techno. its 32-64 for techno even then the beat will sometimes drop.

Atleast you didnt ask "Whats the formula for broken beats" No one would reply :)

[angst]

"don't think, feeeeeel."

[evr]

yah what he said^

just keep practicing and practicing over and over again and after a while you don't even think about it, you just do it and it all works.