random useless question of the day (re:Scientology)

[dabbler]

Purely hypothetical : If you had a good friend who joined the Church of Scientology, and assuming it was clear they were set in their ways -

Would you stop being their friend?



http://calloftheday.com/eSci.html




Personally it would bother me to no end, and I think I would have to stop talking to them for sure.

[tiedye]

Depends on said person. If it took over their life and affected the friendship, sure. If the most that came out of it was a disagreement of beliefs (and probably a few interesting debates) then no.

Really, that's like saying you would cut contact with a friend for converting to Muslim, just because of the radicals out there.

[impure]

a persons religion really doesn't affect how i view them unless they let their religion define themselves, then i can forsee problems.

[dabbler]

YTMND - The Un-Funny Truth About Scientology

[dabbler]

I realize that many of these links could also be propaganda, but there are facts, like "operation snow white" (Operation Snow White - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia)

[prozac]

Well put, Chadwick.

I'm with him on this one. One of the things I learned in 2007 is that it is possible to have a very solid friendship with someone who has beliefs that are directly adversarial to my own. I always thought that I couldn't like or spend time with someone who held opinions/values that I feel are ethically wrong.

It turns out it actually makes for interesting conversation among other things, and can strengthen your own beliefs. Whats the point in having values if you're never challenged to consider and argue why you have them? Being around someone with opposing views can help bring your own into focus.

To get to the point: being a Scientologist is not enough to make me stop being your friend. You'd have to be a Scientologist and an idiot. I know the two seem synonomous lol but I learned with another situation that this is not necesarily the case.

[ebbomega]

I wouldn't think any less of them. Sure, I'd think that their religious beliefs are misguided, erroneous and in many cases detrimental, but I think that of most people with religious beliefs, myself included.

[b0ld]

I always get a kick when I pass by the scientology center on hastings and they have someone outside asking if I would be interested in a "Free" psychological assessment... Right because... you know since I am on hastings I am psychologically unstable and shit... could easily offend somone... Who the hell do they think they are? some type of "God"?.... Oh wait....

[dabbler]

[This comment has been removed due to legal action by the Cult of Scientology.]

[dabbler]

Originally Posted by prozac

I know the two seem synonomous lol but I learned with another situation that this is not necesarily the case.

yeah ok, fair enough

[ebbomega]

Originally Posted by b0ld

I always get a kick when I pass by the scientology center on hastings and they have someone outside asking if I would be interested in a "Free" psychological assessment... Right because... you know since I am on hastings I am psychologically unstable and shit... could easily offend somone... Who the hell do they think they are? some type of "God"?.... Oh wait....

I don't think their location is that intentional.

That center actually does serve as a major job recruiter in town. I know of a few friends that have gone there for job applications and came out not Scientologists.

Basically, I think it works this way: If you're smart, they get you a job. If you're not, they brainwash you.

[azazel]

the only scale tipper for me is skin color.




































or the one drop rule.

[Jonny Dubbs]

would i stop being someones friend because of their spiritual beliefs? no.

[omega_image]

i wouldn't stop being their friend, but i would definitely try to persuade them out of it, even if it meant losing them as a friend.

a lot of people seem to think that the church of scientology is some sort of joke, or light hearted affair when in fact it's a lot more serious than that. hence, if the person in question truly is your friend, then i'd expect people to do all they could in their power to help them.

[Gusto]

apparently the guy who used to live in my apartment was a scientologist, because i still get some of his mail from them. i wouldn't be surprised if he moved without telling them as a way out. they have a history of causing problems for members trying to leave the church.

and no, i wouldn't stop being friends with someone for just joining, but if it changed them into someone i didn't like or want in my life, then yeah.

[Gusto]

Originally Posted by b0ld

I always get a kick when I pass by the scientology center on hastings and they have someone outside asking if I would be interested in a "Free" psychological assessment... Right because... you know since I am on hastings I am psychologically unstable and shit... could easily offend somone... Who the hell do they think they are? some type of "God"?.... Oh wait....

they actually call it a personality test and it's nothing to do with the location. when scientologists recruit people from nice, rich neighbourhoods they use the same terminology.

here's more on the test... pretty funny. How to beat the Scientology Personality Test

i had a bff while growing up that was catholic, until she met the man of their dreams and they had a baby together. during this time, she decided to convert religions and become a jehovah witness. it was not a decision that i felt was right for her, and while i secretly loathed her choice, i accepted her.

but as was true with the cult that she was sucked into, her family and friends were slowly being pushed away. as a jehovah, you dont celebrate things like christmas and birthdays. this made it hard for both her family and her friends to be close to her at a time when it was most important. as time wore on, so did the distance in the relationship.

then one day, she left him, and that wool that had been pulled over her eyes was lifted. she came back to her family, her friends and her religion. the only downfall is, is that now when her daughter comes home from weekend visits with dad, she is convinced that her mom is going to hell cause her and i do hot yoga together. unfortunately, the daughter is not yet old enough to make the religion decision on her own, but young enough to be brainwashed....

what i am trying to say is. i would be as accepting as i could for as long as i could until such time that i would need to push away. when they came back, i would be here with open arms, just as i was here. while most people won't listen to reason, they need to be adult enough to make their own mistakes and learn from them.

[Senior]

I have no problem, in most cases that is, being friends with religious people. on the other hand I don't think they should be able to hold public office or hold any high rank in the military. I don't trust anyone with nukes who listens to imaginary friends.

[ebbomega]

My mum considers herself a born-again Christian. She's never been someone I'd considered pushy about religion, so she's not exactly what you'd consider a Born-Again to be. She has read Tarot cards every day as far back as I can remember, she practices Yoga and Tai Chi, uses Runestones and Angel Cards, has an expansive collection of Chicken Soup For The Soul books, and has regularly pushed me onto various religious texts. Currently she is studying at Vancouver School Of Theology and is trying to get ordained.

One of the first things she taught me as I started to venture in my spiritual journey outside Christian churches was discretion. She'd warn me about a friend of hers who was a devout Christian. One day this friend stepped into my Mum's car, and as she turned on the ignition there was some Buddhist chanting coming from the speakers. She quickly removed her meditation tape, and this friend asked what's that about.

My mum replied "Oh, that's my yoga tape".

And all of a sudden this supposed friend became Uber-Bible-Thumping-Fundy, started asking her how she could consider herself a true Christian and still practice Yoga (in truth, my mum does yoga because she severely damaged her back when she used to skydive, and in 2 years yoga fixed what 10 years of chiropractors couldn't even phase). To this day, my mum's soul is still being "prayed" for.

Sad that people refuse to even look at or consider other religious practices for anything. It has to be in the Bible or it's Heathen. Fundies just piss me off.

"Do what thou wilt, and that is the whole of the law."
(Crowley I think?)

[Grapes]

I've been friends with scientologists before. Said friend ended up converting my brother. I still like both of them well enough but I don't see either of them much.

Can't stop being related to my brother even if I wanted to...

[impure]

Originally Posted by Avana

but as was true with the cult that she was sucked into, her family and friends were slowly being pushed away. as a jehovah, you dont celebrate things like christmas and birthdays. this made it hard for both her family and her friends to be close to her at a time when it was most important. as time wore on, so did the distance in the relationship.

then one day, she left him, and that wool that had been pulled over her eyes was lifted. she came back to her family, her friends and her religion. the only downfall is, is that now when her daughter comes home from weekend visits with dad, she is convinced that her mom is going to hell cause her and i do hot yoga together. unfortunately, the daughter is not yet old enough to make the religion decision on her own, but young enough to be brainwashed.....

my father found a religion through an old hippie friend of his, and when my parents split up when i was 9, i chose to live with him. (for reasons that made sense to a 9 yr old who was mad at her mom for supposedly breaking up her parents) to this day i believe he sought out this religion because they gave the kind of acceptance and understanding that the world had denied him his whole life. and now that i'm an adult, i've come to realize why he was pretty much rejected by the world most of his adult life, my dad is just fucking strange. during his childhood it was extremely rough, in ways i don't think most of us could ever comprehend none of which were his fault. being born in a german refugee camp to parents who were displaced by the war and then moving to chicago when he was 7 1/2 going from the white boy with a german accent when all the other little boys in class had dads coming home from the war saying all germans were devils, prompting the children to ask him where his tail and horns were. then in high school to become the 1% white in an otherwise black school during the black panther movement is hard in ways i can't imagine. perhaps that shaped him into the maladjusted adult that he was, i'll never know.

i think he sought out this religion because they didn't judge him on his life's failures or his history. the just loved and accepted him. the huldamen mennonite religion it's self is quite extreme in many ways, they have their own school the kids of the chuch (47 kids in total when i was there, k-9 most kids didn't go to school past grade 9, educated kids have a tendancy to leave the church) the girls made their own dresses nothing sleeveless or above the knee or fitted they also wore head coverings once they "gave themselves to god" and were baptized (usualy around the age of 15) no TV/radio/internet etc. very close in many ways to amish except the mennonites drive cars and have elecricity and running water, so they're less repressed in some ways i guess.

the first couple years with my dad in this religion were alright but as i grew up i realized that it really wasn't for me. i realized that their "if i can't see it then it doesn't exist" opinion of "the world" as they called it really wasn't for me. anything outside of their church and it's strict views was called "the world" and was either ignored or looked down on in pity as if everyone else was astray from gods flock of perfect little sheep.

once i decided i didn't want to really be a part of that religion, my father began to push it on me, hard. and the more he pushed the more i pushed back. it went on like that for a couple years until, when i was 13 i ran away in the middle of the night. i went to live with my mom in vancouver, and my father has pretty much refused to have anything to do with me since.

recently my big sister came to visit for christmas. i hadn't seen her for 3 or more years because i've been in the US when she came home for christmas. i was told last year that she was heavily medicated for OCD this alarmed me greatly because for those of you who don't know, my big sis is downsyndrome. i didn't believe that people with her mental capacity were able to obsess like she had. so when i saw her this year i became very distraught. she is now obsessivley praying and talks constantly about the devil and evil and satan. she wouldn't accept any of her christmas presents given by my moms family because my father wouldn't approve. the only tv show she'd watch was touched by an angel. on several occasions we found her crying for no explainable reason, by herself. she came bearing news that my father had said he "didn't care if i ever saw your mother or sister again" and that we could "go take a hike". i honestly don't blame the religion for her very disturbing mental state, in fact some of the women in his church have contacted my mother about recent alaming behaviour by my sister. one of the girls i went to school with in his church is my best friend and has been there through thick and thin, she and i despite religious differences will never change because sh

seeing her now really makes me believe that decision to run away in the middle of that june night years ago was the best decision of my life.

one of the girls i went to school with in his church is my best friend and has been there through thick and thin, she and i despite religious differences will never change because she doesn't let her religion define her. it is only an aspect to her personal life.

that is why i said earlier, religion is fine on a personal level, but when someone i know lets it begin to define them and affect others around them, then i begin to have a huge problem.


avana, you got your friend back, which in my opinion is no small miracle. i seem to have lost a father to religion, and frankly after seeing my sister now, i think i'm better off for it.

[galaxie]

Originally Posted by tiedye

Depends on said person. If it took over their life and affected the friendship, sure. If the most that came out of it was a disagreement of beliefs (and probably a few interesting debates) then no.

Really, that's like saying you would cut contact with a friend for converting to Muslim, just because of the radicals out there.

First of all, you don't convert to Muslim, you convert to Islam. Muslims are followers of the religion of Islam.

As for Scientology - IMO it's a fucked up pseudo-religion and you have to be pretty wacko to believe in that crap. Therefore, if I had a friend join the Church of Scientology I'd likely write them off as being crazy.

Edit: I think who are so deeply invested in religion that they allow it to define them aren't worth my time. Unless I agree with every single thing they say, I'm no good. My dad's mom had been like this my whole life and after he passed away when I was 15 I cut her off - it's not fair to be a kid and have your grandmother causing drama in your life because you don't worship the same god or the same way that she does.

[Grapes]

Originally Posted by galaxie

As for Scientology - IMO it's a fucked up pseudo-religion and you have to be pretty wacko to believe in that crap. Therefore, if I had a friend join the Church of Scientology I'd likely write them off as being crazy.

My brother is definetely eccentric, and probably a bit naive, but I really don't think he's crazy or wacko.

[Revolver]

Originally Posted by galaxie

First of all, you don't convert to Muslim, you convert to Islam. Muslims are followers of the religion of Islam.

SSSSSSSMACK.

[galaxie]

Originally Posted by Grapes

My brother is definetely eccentric, and probably a bit naive, but I really don't think he's crazy or wacko.

He must be a bit naive, doesn't Scientology require you to pay large sums of money to remain a member of the Church? Or am I misinformed? I don't really know that much about it other than they seem to have some strange beliefs...oh and that Tom Cruise is nuts, which likely gives Scientologists a bad name.