Supreme Court refuses to hear appeal

[Alex]

Decision stands, Airlines have to give a 2nd seat FREE to obese passengers.

Wow, that's unbelievable. I can't even fathom how society has come to determine that obesity, a choice, is now a disability that others have to accommodate. You can't fit in 1 seat and need 2? Pay the extra money, or stop eating greasy food and hit the gym. Morbidly obese people need to stop whining, company's not being willing to accommodate a disgusting and unhealthy lifestyle choice is not discrimination. The vast majority of obese individuals let it happen to themselves through over eating, improper nutrition, and lack of physical exercise. Society and businesses shouldn't have to go out of their ways for people who are so pathetic and lazy that they can't even take care of their own body's and health.

[ebbomega]

So what if they have a thyroid problem?

[Courtney]

fat is a choice...obesity isn't

ok so being fat is not cancer but it's like an addiction -which is still a mental disorder...and there is science to back up the fact that addiction isn't just a "choice".
Also, if you are uneducated and you have been brough up in an unhealthy home it is all you know and you learn to take on those same eating habits. It is hard to break out of a viscious cycle like this. I believe this is a fair decision.

[NinjaBoy]

Originally Posted by Alex

The vast majority of obese individuals let it happen to themselves through over eating, improper nutrition, and lack of physical exercise.

There's why the Supreme court is holding up the decision.

The vast majority, but not all. So you can't screw over those people in order for the ones that have made the choice to be punished.

That being said, it's sad that society even has this problem.

[Courtney]

You are a smart guy alex but you fail to look at the humanistic way of looking things
They may be choices to a certain extent but you need to look at the history and life experiences that have happened...it is not always as easy as becoming unlazy!!
same goes for addiction,homelessness etc.maybe if like you said the "society and businesses" actually cared about the health of others we would be doing something to help rather than stamping unprecidented lables such as "lazy" on these people

[Alex]

ebbomega, just because one has a thyroid problem doesn't mean they have no choices.

People with thyroid problems have a slower metabolism, and less energy, making it harder for them to lose weight, easier to gain weight.

1. Their are drugs designed to replace the thyroid hormone
2. Just because staying healthy is more difficult, is no excuse to completely give up.


Courtney- you're an idiot.


Ninjaboy- Yes, the vast majority. If someone has a legitimate disability causing them to be morbidly obese(I remember a guy spoke at my junior high way back when, he had been a ski instructor and crashed in to a tree. doctors needed to remove a part of his brain to save his life, and because of this he couldn't lose weight. He was forever on disability and was on a strict diet, and a strict training regiment working out a minimum of 8 hours a day as if he didn't he would most certainly die yet he was still over 300 pounds), I'd much rather prefer the government to cover costs for an extra seat, rather than passing the responsibility on to the private sector.

[Alex]

Courtney honestly you need to realize individuals are responsible for their own actions. I feel really bad for people in other countries, but in Canada everyone has access to free health care and education until they reach adulthood. Right from the beginning schools teach proper nutrition and mandatory physical education. If parents aren't properly feeding their off spring(and their are no excuses as buying fruits and vegetables and fresh meat and breads/whole wheat pasta and rice's for the most part is the same price if not cheaper(usually) than buying pre packaged garbage) I believe said parents should be considered unfit to parent, and their children should be removed from them until they can provide a situation where the children eat properly and get enough physical exercise.

[NinjaBoy]

Originally Posted by Alex

Ninjaboy- Yes, the vast majority. If someone has a legitimate disability causing them to be morbidly obese(I remember a guy spoke at my junior high way back when, he had been a ski instructor and crashed in to a tree. doctors needed to remove a part of his brain to save his life, and because of this he couldn't lose weight. He was forever on disability and was on a strict diet, and a strict training regiment working out a minimum of 8 hours a day as if he didn't he would most certainly die yet he was still over 300 pounds), I'd much rather prefer the government to cover costs for an extra seat, rather than passing the responsibility on to the private sector.

Assigning blame on a case by case basis is a delicious recipe for disaster.

How does one decide who has a legitimate claim and who does not?

[Alex]

Severity of whatever disability the person has to possibly cause obesity.

If it's just laziness it's their own fault, IE if it could have been preventable.

[ebbomega]

Given that our general understanding of obesity is so slim (pun unintended - science can't even agree that exercise and diet are the primary contributing factors) your plan lacks plausibility.

How exactly does one determine how one became obese? Is there a catch-all test for this? Because if there is then maybe you should let the scientific community aware of such a test, they might find it useful.

[Pussy*Kat]

So Alex, youre telling me everyone who is over a certain weight and requires an extra seat for a comfortable flight must now submit valid doctor documentation proving they have a disability and it is not their fault they are overweight?


The last thing I think an airline company needs is a waiting list for potential ticket buyers while proper documentation is collected (and reviewed) in order to prove they are ligitimatly disabled and not just a fat lazy fuck

[kir mokum]

i hear they have a breathalyzer for laziness now.

[NinjaBoy]

Originally Posted by Alex

If it's just laziness it's their own fault, IE if it could have been preventable.

Yes, but HOW?

I'm pretty sure, most people blame their morbid obesity on psychological problems. And there are plenty of doctors willing to back up this diagnostic for them.

So it's impossible to go around with a rubber stamp saying, "It's your fault, it's your fault, it's your fault, it's not your fault, it's your fault..."

[Alex]

"Causes of Obesity

Obesity occurs when your body consumes more calories than it burns. In the past, many people thought that obesity was simply caused by over-eating and under-exercising, resulting from a lack of will power and self-control. Although these are significant contributing factors, doctors recognize that obesity is a complex medical problem that involves genetic, environmental, behavioural, and social factors. All these factors play a role in determining a person's weight.
Recent research shows that in some cases, certain genetic factors may cause the changes in appetite and fat metabolism that lead to obesity. For a person who is genetically prone to weight gain (e.g., has a lower metabolism) and who leads an inactive and unhealthy lifestyle, the risk of becoming obese is high.
Although a person's genetic makeup may contribute to obesity, it's not the primary cause. Environmental and behavioural factors have a greater influence - consuming excess calories from high-fat foods and doing little or no daily physical activity over the long run will lead to weight gain. Psychological factors may also foster obesity. Low self-esteem, guilt, emotional stress, or trauma can lead to overeating as a means to cope with the problem. "

[Courtney]

Originally Posted by Alex

Courtney honestly you need to realize individuals are responsible for their own actions. I feel really bad for people in other countries, but in Canada everyone has access to free health care and education until they reach adulthood. Right from the beginning schools teach proper nutrition and mandatory physical education. If parents aren't properly feeding their off spring(and their are no excuses as buying fruits and vegetables and fresh meat and breads/whole wheat pasta and rice's for the most part is the same price if not cheaper(usually) than buying pre packaged garbage) I believe said parents should be considered unfit to parent, and their children should be removed from them until they can provide a situation where the children eat properly and get enough physical exercise.

As a poor student I can honestly say shitty food is MUCH cheaper than healthy food.....

[Alex]

ebbomega, the leading contributor is consuming too many calories, not burning enough. Other factors contribute to obesity, and make it harder for individuals to lose weight. However, to be so severely obese that you CAN NOT FIT IN A SEAT ON AN AIRPLANE can be prevented by proper diet and exercise, regardless of outside factors.

[kir mokum]

i think it's awesome that Mr. Personal Responsibility Rand wants to use more bureaucracy to enforce it.

[Courtney]

"Low self-esteem, guilt, emotional stress, or trauma can lead to overeating as a means to cope with the problem. "

Exactly. So someone has been abused,lost a parent/child,been fired and they start overeating and one thing leads to another.......give them a break...let them have a fucking second seat

[Alex]

Originally Posted by Pussy*Kat

So Alex, youre telling me everyone who is over a certain weight and requires an extra seat for a comfortable flight must now submit valid doctor documentation proving they have a disability and it is not their fault they are overweight?


The last thing I think an airline company needs is a waiting list for potential ticket buyers while proper documentation is collected (and reviewed) in order to prove they are ligitimatly disabled and not just a fat lazy fuck

No, I think seeing as the government decided they should be accommodated, the government should screen individuals and compensate them for the extra ticket needed on a case by case basis, and leave corporations out of the fiasco.

[Phrenetic]

thank you fnk for weighing in your thoughts

[Courtney]

Courtney- you're an idiot.


QUOTE]



and you aren't!???????!@$#@$!%!%!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!

[NinjaBoy]

Originally Posted by Alex

No, I think seeing as the government decided they should be accommodated, the government should screen individuals and compensate them for the extra ticket needed on a case by case basis, and leave corporations out of the fiasco.

Ya totally, the airlines have never benefited from government intervention.

[kir mokum]

i'd also like to point out that alex is taking the side of an industry that's been so poorly run and managed that they've had to be bailed out repeatedly by our government.

[Alex]

Originally Posted by Courtney

"Low self-esteem, guilt, emotional stress, or trauma can lead to overeating as a means to cope with the problem. "

Exactly. So someone has been abused,lost a parent/child,been fired and they start overeating and one thing leads to another.......give them a break...let them have a fucking second seat

As a consumer who travels by airlines semi-frequently, I have a huge issue with airlines comping a seat for these people. No doubt this costs airlines income, and that lost income will translate in to higher flight fares(and probably higher than the lost income to boot).

You can't just use the logic of 'who cares it's just a seat, they might have had a bad childhood let them have it'
That's bullshit.

[ebbomega]

Originally Posted by Alex

"Causes of Obesity

Obesity occurs when your body consumes more calories than it burns. In the past, many people thought that obesity was simply caused by over-eating and under-exercising, resulting from a lack of will power and self-control. Although these are significant contributing factors, doctors recognize that obesity is a complex medical problem that involves genetic, environmental, behavioural, and social factors. All these factors play a role in determining a person's weight.
Recent research shows that in some cases, certain genetic factors may cause the changes in appetite and fat metabolism that lead to obesity. For a person who is genetically prone to weight gain (e.g., has a lower metabolism) and who leads an inactive and unhealthy lifestyle, the risk of becoming obese is high.
Although a person's genetic makeup may contribute to obesity, it's not the primary cause. Environmental and behavioural factors have a greater influence - consuming excess calories from high-fat foods and doing little or no daily physical activity over the long run will lead to weight gain. Psychological factors may also foster obesity. Low self-esteem, guilt, emotional stress, or trauma can lead to overeating as a means to cope with the problem. "

Citation needed pls.

Also, a lot of the conclusions made here are based off correlational research, which can make no claims to causality, merely that trends are linked - is it the laziness that causes obesity or the obesity that causes laziness or is it that some other factor is causing both the obesity and the laziness?