Provincial election coming up!

[-ff-]

^

Well, there is a limit to how low people will be able to limit pollution. Industry will always pollute - under this scheme, they'd just have to start paying for their dammned externalities.

[rawb]

i'm not poor, i'm not a student and i'm not in a union.

have no idea why i would vote anyone but liberal.

[Alex]

Originally Posted by rawb

i'm not poor, i'm not a student and i'm not in a union.

have no idea why i would vote anyone but liberal.

\


YUP.

too bad their wasn't any party a little more conservative.

[-ff-]

MORE conservative?

What, you want someone who burns crosses or something?

[Listening_room]

Originally Posted by Sidekick

supposed to bring in as much money as the other tax that it replaced, then if the companies start lowering their pollution won't the government receive less in taxes? double-edged sword with that one, it seems.

Governments would simply increase tax per unit of pollution.

click hear for more info

[Listening_room]

Originally Posted by -ff-

MORE conservative?

What, you want someone who burns crosses or something?

^^What I think he means is more libertarian.


Don't think of the political spectrum as 1 dimensional - think of it as 2d. Although this model is still far too simplistic, it helps illustrate the difference between freedom and statism which is often glossed over in the left/right model

Statists want the government to control, libertarians want individuals to control.

Stephen Harper (for example) is an economic libertarian but a social conservative.

Campbell on the other hand is fairly economically and socially libertarian.

[Listening_room]

double posting

[-ff-]

Originally Posted by Listening_room

Don't think of the political spectrum as 2d - it's far too simplistic that way.

Believe me, I'm well aware of the multiple dimensions politics can take. I didnt waste four years of my life getting a degree in political theory for nothing!

I was being outrageous on purpose.

[Listening_room]

Originally Posted by -ff-

I was being outrageous on purpose.

I hope so =)~

[sidekick]

Originally Posted by Listening_room

Governments would simply increase tax per unit of pollution.

then what would be the companies incentive for lowering their pollution emissions? if as soon as they lower them the government just increases the tax per unit of pollution...they might as well not do anything to lower them at all.

i'm not saying i don't agree with this idea of 'green tax' or whatever it is they called it on that website...but i don't think that it can realistically take the place of other forms of tax.

[Listening_room]

Originally Posted by Sidekick

then what would be the companies incentive for lowering their pollution emissions? if as soon as they lower them the government just increases the tax per unit of pollution...they might as well not do anything to lower them at all.

i'm not saying i don't agree with this idea of 'green tax' or whatever it is they called it on that website...but i don't think that it can realistically take the place of other forms of tax.

The process takes years. All competitive advantages are temporary. These temporary advantages (like general technological advances that reduce costs) produce excess profits for those who have adapted. Temporary excess profits (in a competitive environment) are enough of an incentive to produce action.

Over time government would ratchet up the tax rate. Business would see it in their interest to adapt further. This process is well documented in economic studies where tax-shifting and/or pollution markets are created.

[Senior]

I haven't looked at any of this with more than a galnce but really this is a pretty straight forward case. Campbell needs to fuck off to rehab and STV needs to get passed. As it stands our electoral system hasn't reflected majority will since the NDP's win back in 92'.

My early prediction is that the NDP will slowly gain in the polls right up to e day and have a fairly decent chance of winning.

As for someone saying Campbell is so great and such an asset I completely disagree. His popularity rating among women is at 15% or something and 45% or so with men and he might lose his seat to a realitive new comer, Mel Lehan. With Gordo what it really comesdown to is that no one trusts him or likes him. He has been tarred and feathered as a lying drunk with no morals.

[TheCooker]

Enough is enough

NDP - I've always been a social democrat.
The HUGE increase in student tuitition has personally affected me. I look forward to a new provincial government that can deal with such an issue.
- Tuitition Platforms
Liberals - You pay big time
Green - Cut tuitition down 5% a year, until it is free. Ummm yeah right
NDP - Immediate tuition freeze of one year

[Alex]

Originally Posted by -ff-

MORE conservative?

What, you want someone who burns crosses or something?

fck no. economically conservative.

i.e. lower taxes, privatization(two tiered education and health care systems), removal of crown corporations such as ICBC(ugh I hate ICBC) reduction of some useless social programs, etc.

I don't think religion should have any place in politics... I believe religion and spirituality should be sought by the individual, and shouldn't be propogandised.

however, BC is far too socialist for my liking... not nearly enough propoganda which has lead to the poor, ignorant masses far too much control. I love Vancouver, but economically I have little reason to stay. I make great money, however i could transfer to a different city in the US for more pay and less taxes. The elite of our society have let the masses take control, It's sad, really.

[The_acidhouse]

Originally Posted by TheCooker

Enough is enough

NDP - I've always been a social democrat.
The HUGE increase in student tuitition has personally affected me. I look forward to a new provincial government that can deal with such an issue.
- Tuitition Platforms
Liberals - You pay big time
Green - Cut tuitition down 5% a year, until it is free. Ummm yeah right
NDP - Immediate tuition freeze of one year

I guess you don't know what causes inflation.

[TheCooker]

Originally Posted by The_acidhouse

I guess you don't know what causes inflation.

Hmmm no I don't! Do you think you do? Damn that would make you the first person on the planet to understand inflation, to understand it well enough to know what causes it.

:sixpak: LMAO Back to reality no one know's what exactly causes it...that's why we are completly at its mercy.

Typical birdbrain answer..."we doubled tuitition thanks to inflation, damn you inflation!" lol

[The_acidhouse]

Originally Posted by TheCooker

Hmmm no I don't! Do you think you do? Damn that would make you the first person on the planet to understand inflation, to understand it well enough to know what causes it.

:sixpak: LMAO Back to reality no one know's what exactly causes it...that's why we are completly at its mercy.

Typical birdbrain answer..."we doubled tuitition thanks to inflation, damn you inflation!" lol

Plenty of people on this planet understand inflation.

Take Milton Friedman for example.

As you can see, I'm clearly setting you up here. So, as you will also see, you are the birdbrain.

Although there are other more subtle drivers for inflation (oil prices, minimum wage etc...) the main factor is the money supply. Monetary policy allows for a hidden tax created by the federal government. As the federal government increases the money supply it devalues the dollar.

The federal government benefits from this as it monetizes the national debt (makes the debt look less and less small).

This inflation hurts the poor. If you have no assets (ie. you are a student) you are not able to hedge against inflation. You remain fully exposed to it. Contrast this with someone who owns a house which appreciates with the inflation - they are protected as their assets rise in value.

So, what am I trying to say here?
Well - basically that unless you believe the government should pay for 100% of your post-secondary education, you need to accept the reality of our monetary policy. Once you have accepted this, you will conclude that the source of the inflation is federal government policy - not provincial government policy.

The provincial government has no control over inflation. All that it has control over is spending. If the provincial government was to fully fund the education system, what would occur is that provincial taxes would have to rise which in turn would chase investment away producing lower provincial tax income and producing a faster and faster spiral of debt (much like what occured under the NDP). This increasing sprial of debt produces a risk. This risk (of default) means that investors demand higher and higher rates of interest. In other words, the increasing debt causes the provinces credit rating to worsen.

What the provincial Liberals did was cut spending by raising tuition costs. The result was a rapid rise in tuition costs in order to catch up with what the market rate for tuition should be. Once this caught up, the rate of tuition will rise at 2-3% per year - following the rate of inflation set by the federal government's monetary policy.

In the process, the provincial Liberals were able to increase investment which has created more employment in the province. This has helped restore the tax base. The fact that the budget is balanced (and not spiraling out of control) means that the provinces credit rating has improved (meaning that less tax dollars are spent servicing a higher % rate of interest).

[Ree Fresh]

Originally Posted by Senior

With Gordo what it really comesdown to is that no one trusts him or likes him. He has been tarred and feathered as a lying drunk with no morals.

This is what sucks about this election. So many ppl who belive in a liberal way of government cant vote liberal because of Gordon Cambell, as every single CUPE member in BC just got a letter telling us not to vote for for "the under Gordon Cambell Lieberals".

Government seems to be a pendulum. Every party pisses the public off, therefore each election the public gets fed up and goes back to the other party... Pathetic.

[ebbomega]

This is BC. All we're deciding is who is going to screw us over for the next few years.

I think this year I'm just going to write up a big essay on my ballot as to why I'm spoiling it.

[TheCooker]

Originally Posted by The_acidhouse

Plenty of people on this planet understand inflation.

Take Milton Friedman for example.

As you can see, I'm clearly setting you up here. So, as you will also see, you are the birdbrain.

Although there are other more subtle drivers for inflation (oil prices, minimum wage etc...) the main factor is the money supply. Monetary policy allows for a hidden tax created by the federal government. As the federal government increases the money supply it devalues the dollar.

The federal government benefits from this as it monetizes the national debt (makes the debt look less and less small).

This inflation hurts the poor. If you have no assets (ie. you are a student) you are not able to hedge against inflation. You remain fully exposed to it. Contrast this with someone who owns a house which appreciates with the inflation - they are protected as their assets rise in value.

So, what am I trying to say here?
Well - basically that unless you believe the government should pay for 100% of your post-secondary education, you need to accept the reality of our monetary policy. Once you have accepted this, you will conclude that the source of the inflation is federal government policy - not provincial government policy.

The provincial government has no control over inflation. All that it has control over is spending. If the provincial government was to fully fund the education system, what would occur is that provincial taxes would have to rise which in turn would chase investment away producing lower provincial tax income and producing a faster and faster spiral of debt (much like what occured under the NDP). This increasing sprial of debt produces a risk. This risk (of default) means that investors demand higher and higher rates of interest. In other words, the increasing debt causes the provinces credit rating to worsen.

What the provincial Liberals did was cut spending by raising tuition costs. The result was a rapid rise in tuition costs in order to catch up with what the market rate for tuition should be. Once this caught up, the rate of tuition will rise at 2-3% per year - following the rate of inflation set by the federal government's monetary policy.

In the process, the provincial Liberals were able to increase investment which has created more employment in the province. This has helped restore the tax base. The fact that the budget is balanced (and not spiraling out of control) means that the provinces credit rating has improved (meaning that less tax dollars are spent servicing a higher % rate of interest).

Blah blah blah....set me up ok, sure. Yes I know plenty of people try and understand inflation, that's why people study Economic's.
However your statement

I guess you don't know what causes inflation.

Leads one to believe that you, or anyone for that matter, can prove what causes inflation. Here you are again "NO ONE KNOW'S!" You know this, and tried to fog me with some figures on tuition rise in BC...2-3% you said....

So I'll ask you this. If tuition rises 2-3% a year with inflation, how come some program costs have increased up to 100%? Even with a annual increase of 3%, over ten years thats only 30%. If you can't answer this, simply say so, don't beat around the bush, and trap yo'self. Looks like BC student are paying for more than they're education.

Here's a idea for you, start with baby steps and understand this:
Inflation is not just a federal problem, it's everyones problem.

Birdbrain or not I don't play make believe, and shift responsibility. By you stating:

you will conclude that the source of the inflation is federal government policy - not provincial government policy.

Is like Gordon Campbell saying BC's booming economy is all because of him. LMAO...when we all know that really nice interest rates have helped us along.


In the end, as I simply said before:

I look forward to a new provincial government that can deal with such an issue.

[mapleleaf4ever]

Am I the only person here that votes for the Party and not the individual?

[TheCooker]

Well it should be for the party with the platform you prefer most. However in some cases when the riding has a big name MP or MLA, or one that really helps out and cares for their area...people will vote for them...no matter what party they are a member of!

[mapleleaf4ever]

What I'm saying is that everyone should do what you said. Read the Platforms, and pick the Party that most represents their views. I'm just seeing a lot of people that are all like "Don't vote Liberal because Gordon Campbell is a Drunk Driver..." well he isn't the entire Government now is he? All he is is a face to the Government. Now he may not be the best face to have but that is what we have to deal with. So cut the parties some slack, just because their leaders may be a big bunch of immoral, ill-educated, deficient fools doesn't mean that the rest of the Party is likewise.

[Crazy Dave]

let me see. Some jerk that got a deck build, or some jerk that trying to sell off BC to his friends. Lets talk about conflict of interest.

NPD where jerks (hey all goverment is) but they where doing a better job for average person in B.C.

[mapleleaf4ever]

^ If you call wasting everything and putting BC in an economic fiasco a better job for the average person then yes, yes they were.