bombing in bali

[mugsy]

first im shocked im the first one to be making a thread about this. (unless if i have overlooked it)
bombing in kuta and on jimbaran beach. death toll is at 36 right now, injuries over 100, and missing persons lists must be long.
all reasons point to the same as the previous bombings in 2002 - muslims\al quaida (sp?) wanting to make all of indonesia muslim and the balinese are not, the balinese being so accepting and wanting tourism within there country, and the amount of tourist\the tourist themselves (mostly austrailian) taking advantage of the island and helping with the americanization\westernization of bali.

feelings on the situation?

this personally, brings many feelings up to the front for me. as a final family vacation with my dad, he was planning and still is on a trip to bali in march. (tickets to be baught on monday\still looking around for the cheapest flight)
he still wants to go as do i. but what if questions of course come up, the same what if questions that could be applied to travel in many places now. i was shocked that my mom would rather go to london, when bombings have happened a heck of alot more in their history - past and present - than in bali. my only hold up is seeing\witnessing devastation. its very self centered but i just dont know if i could in fact handle seeing devastation on that sort of magnitude in person. even though it would be 6 months later, something like this doesnt just dissapear.
not to mention all the feelings i have towards the entire situation of why this is happening. the sadness and helplessness im sure every person feels when something like this is read or heard about, the feeling of anger of why someone could do this to another human let alone crowds of people. and why we cant be fucking accepting of our neighbours.... but this issue has been disscussed in many levels, and i would never front like i knew enough to make an educated response to issues such as these.

comments, feelings? and feel free to correct any information i may have gotten wrong.

[mapleleaf4ever]

First I've heard of this... then again I haven't checked the News today.

[fable]

thx for posting this, ill have to get to a reply when i get more time-

think about these two sections of what you had initially posted::

all reasons point to the same as the previous bombings in 2002 - muslims\al quaida (sp?) wanting to make all of indonesia muslim

helping with the americanization\westernization of bali.

you have a right to be concerned, thats understandable, BUT also take into consideration in a more general sense, that it is very easy to get caught up in the "fear mongering"

Admitedly i do not have a good grasp of what the current political situation is specific to the region, im using similair sentiment in other bordering nations as a guideline (my friends stories of debauchery dont really help me out too much)

Think on the two sections i highlighted.

- Think about what "westernization" really looks like in Bali - who does it help, does it at all? Who would benefit from it, who would not?

- What kind of resistance movements have excisted in bali over the last few years. What is the reality of any Al Quaida group members being in Bali? Why would they be there? Who would be a target? Why?

Why did you immedietly put "muslims" and "al quiada" in relation with eachother? Who is the Al Quiada? What are there demands? Who are they targeting? Why? ***What is there relationship with the US government***

peace+'spect
shak

[mojo]

shit like this scares me.

i know the beach, and it was packed in may. i would hate to have been there.

rip surfer dudes.

[Grapes]

first im shocked im the first one to be making a thread about this.

Are you?

[mugsy]

^ yeah its fnk... but usually people are pretty up on current events like this.

[Grapes]

When was the last post you saw about a bombing in Iraq?

Thousands and thousands of people have been killed there since the last bombing in Bali.

The likelihood of someone posting about it is relative to how connected people on here feel to the culture that got attacked. Bali ranks above the middle east, but obviously way below somewhere like London.

I'm not surprised that no-one posted about it.

[fable]

perhaps the bombing was in lieu of this:

Despite widespread protests, Indonesia has announced sharp hikes in domestic fuel prices to pare crippling energy subsidies that contributed to a near meltdown of the rupiah currency in August.

Mines and Energy Minister Purnomo Yusgiantoro on Friday said the price of gasoline was raised by 87.5% to 4,500 rupiah (44 US cents) a litre; diesel by 105% to 4300 rupiah a litre and household kerosene, used for cooking, by 186% to 2000 rupiah a litre. ($1=10,300 rupiah)



The increases take effect on Saturday.

Earlier, riot police fired tear gas at rock-throwing students who were among thousands demonstrating on the eve of fuel price increases, which Indonesia's president defended as the only way to stave off an economic crisis.

Security forces on Friday chased down more than 100 demonstrators in the centre of Jakarta, hitting some with sticks, after the youths set tyres ablaze, vandalised a bus and exchanged a volley of rocks with police on a busy street near their campus.

Thousands demonstrated
against the fuel price hike

"Anarchy will only deter investment," said President Susilo Bambang Yudhoyono, who has made the decision to raise the price of petrol, diesel fuel and kerosene.

The fuel price hike is bound to push up the price of everything from rice to cigarettes in the sprawling country of 220 million people, half of whom live on less than $2 a day.

Slashing subsidies

The price increases follow Yudhoyono's decision to slash fuel subsidies that have helped protect Indonesia's poorest from spiralling global prices for years, but also threatened to blow the cash-strapped government's budget.

Last year, the government doled out $7.4 billion for the subsidies -more than the international community has pledged on rebuilding efforts in countries hit by last year's tsunami.

"I realise that this is not a popular policy, a bitter pill that we have to swallow, but we have to do it to save the nation's budget and the future of the country," Yudhoyono said.

Thousands turned out for demonstrations in at least 17 cities nationwide, but most were peaceful, scattered and small -given the size of the country and its history of massive street rallies.

Oil imports

"I realise that this is not a popular policy, a bitter pill that we have to swallow, but we have to do it to save the nation's budget and the future of the country"

Susilo Bambang Yudhoyono, Indonesian President

Aside from the brief clash in Jakarta, there were few reports of violence. Despite being Southeast Asia's only member of Opec, Indonesia imports oil because of decades of declining investment in exploration and extraction due to corruption and a weak legal system that makes people wary of doing business here.

Most in Indonesia agree the current subsidies - which allow Indonesian motorists to fill up for less than 25 US cents a litre (95 cents a gallon) - are unsustainable.

Still, raising prices is a sensitive issue in Indonesia, where a massive increase in 1998 triggered rioting that helped topple former dictator Suharto. Protests also forced former President Megawati Sukarnoputri to scale back a fuel price increase in 2002.

This is the second time Yudhoyono, who was elected last year on promises to fight poverty and revive the economy, has pushed up prices. Some said he betrayed those who put him in office.

"I'm disappointed in SBY," said Achmad Syarif, 21, referring to the president by his initials as many Indonesians do. "This is going to place a heavy burden on the people... There have to be other ways to solve the economic crisis."

peace+'spect
fable

[mugsy]

^ do you know why the first bombing happened?
coincidence that the leader of the same extremeist muslim al quaidia realted groups' leader that was incharge for those bombings was released two weeks ago for a hospital visit?

this is not your average US involved\oil bombing. not everything invovle the big bad wolf of the world.

maybe im being naieve, but i actually give the media some credit on this one as they are not saying its an attack on the US or the westerners. its an attack on the balinese - one of hte last islands over there to not be muslim. not only are they not muslim but they are involved with tourism and everything tourism has to offer - the money, the exploitation, the half-clad women, ect.

why then bomb areas where mostly tourists will be hurt?
becasue they are the ones encouraging this. its their money that pushes this industry.

it upsets me that cultures and religions still can not accept one another. its one the many reasons i dont have faith, human acceptance is more important to me then faith. i have memebers of my family that are extremists when it comes to their religions - none of them as extreme as these groups but extreme enough to tell loved ones awful things, terrify them into believing and forcing them to do things they dont know are moral right or unright.

another thing that saddens me is that the suicide bombers are usually so young, and impressionable. but thats a whole other can of worms.

[fable]

^ do you know why the first bombing happened?
coincidence that the leader of the same extremeist muslim al quaidia realted groups' leader that was incharge for those bombings was released two weeks ago for a hospital visit?

Hmm, can you clarifiy this, i dont know if its the mispelling or grammar, but i cant understand it?

this is not your average US involved\oil bombing. not everything invovle the big bad wolf of the world.

No, they dont, but as a result of imperialstic action, colonization, and non representation of governments, extremists action, dissent among poor and working classes, and pure fundamentalism will continue to grow-this is the primary result of social fragmentation.

maybe im being naieve, but i actually give the media some credit on this one as they are not saying its an attack on the US or the westerners. its an attack on the balinese - one of hte last islands over there to not be muslim. not only are they not muslim but they are involved with tourism and everything tourism has to offer - the money, the exploitation, the half-clad women, ect.

Your coming dangerousley close to Islamaphobia. You think a terrorist group is throwing down bombs because of specifics like the rise of "half clad women" Its about sending out a message in resistance to western philosophies and influence PERIOD. And yes you are projecting an image if naivety - but atleast you are asking questions.

why then bomb areas where mostly tourists will be hurt?
becasue they are the ones encouraging this. its their money that pushes this industry.

Its a pure WESTERN philosophy to accept the notion that being predominantly reliant on tourist dollars is a GOOD THING. If it was premeditated, then its the tourists themselves that they wanted to hurt/maim/kill.

It upsets me that cultures and religions still can not accept one another. its one the many reasons i dont have faith, human acceptance is more important to me then faith. i have memebers of my family that are extremists when it comes to their religions - none of them as extreme as these groups but extreme enough to tell loved ones awful things, terrify them into believing and forcing them to do things they dont know are moral right or unright.

Yes its very sad indeed. But please note that although ALL religeons have their share of fundamentalists, it is WESTERN Christianity and Judaism which are entwined in amongst western foreign imperialistic policy that is currently under attack across the globe

another thing that saddens me is that the suicide bombers are usually so young, and impressionable. but thats a whole other can of worms.

Nope, its the SAME can of worms! look for the connections.

peace+'spect
shak