Production Question!

[nabs]

What is considered a good rate for normalizing a whole set? such as how much below 0 db? the program i use automatically does it to -3 DB. is that fine?

[nabs]

or is just below 0 DB fine?

[mux]

apparently some older CD players and DVD players had problems reproducing 0dB and would distort or refuse to play the disc, so the rule of thumb is to normalize to -0.3.

[Technix]

I use Adobe Auditon 1.0 for mastering mixes and tracks. It has a hard limiting function that will bring samples up to the same decibel level (I also use 0.3dB as the marker) - makes the mix/track flow so much smoother.

Normalizing only determines and normalizes the loudest sample, and all other samples are increased/decreased by the amount of the loudest sample - so your mix or track won't truly be normalized at -0.3dB. Hard limiting is the answer.

You may want to look into other equalizing and mastering software if you want to make flawless mixes.

[BenGiovanni]

knowing how to use the gains properly can be a good alternative aswell... i remember once my buddy tried to normalize a few mixes of mine...only to see that the program didnt normalize much since the levels were constant...

[inside]

Originally Posted by mux

apparently some older CD players and DVD players had problems reproducing 0dB and would distort or refuse to play the disc, so the rule of thumb is to normalize to -0.3.

yep, yep.

[optimum sound]

The actual db level on a cd released by a mayor record company is -6db. I personally find normalizing to be a very quick and easy way to not mastering a mix by ear, then again not everyone has access to pro tools.

[Wood]

^really? cause i master all my cds to 0 db (using a similar hard limiting plug-in to what Technix described above) yet most pressed CDs still sound louder. what am i missing?

[mux]

Originally Posted by Wood

^really? cause i master all my cds to 0 db (using a similar hard limiting plug-in to what Technix described above) yet most pressed CDs still sound louder. what am i missing?

Your CDs may refuse to play or distort on some older home CD systems, car systems, etc. Any player made since about 2000 will likely work fine, but it's still worth going to slightly under 0dB just to make sure everyone can listen to them.

At least, that's what I was told. Sounds reasonable to me. Not like you can really notice 0.3dB of difference anyway, so why not? :)

[optimum sound]

Honestly I don't do -6db either, I believe it has to to do with the fact cds are in wav format because at -6db a wav will definitely be always be louder than an mp3. As for for doing -0.3 is fine, just make sure there's headroom in case the mix happens to go over 0db withouth being noticed.
I like to do -2db usually, its so little nobody withouth a trained ear notices.

Originally Posted by Wood

^really? cause i master all my cds to 0 db (using a similar hard limiting plug-in to what Technix described above) yet most pressed CDs still sound louder. what am i missing?

[Skyles]

as for -6db and -0.3db being louder, amplitude volume and depth comes from the mid-range (that are most sensitive to our ears).

So that being said... if you balance your eq's right, prior to hard limiting you can get the amplitude volume up quite significantly even with -6db. Just gotta know your zones.

Try ducking the 200-350hz zone slightly.. as it's a problem zone for being too loud, or else when hard limiting it'll "muddy" and make the midrange seem quieter.

But keeping in mind, not all professional CD's are done that way... the type of music really depends on the max decibal level. I was at a convention with a guy who mixes for van halen and some rnb cheeseballs, he was saying he hits -0.1 for everything he mixes for RnB, but -6fb for the van halen stuff. Then again, sending it out to the mastering house is a different story all together.

Where's Alex from suite sound, whats the average you guys do there?
Because i know mastering for vinyl is a different level..

broadcast, i always send my bits as -12db because they then bring it into the analogue domain, which is unity in the A world i believe.

[Technix]

Here's a screenshot of a Astral Projection - Mahadeva track mix I'm working on...you'll notice the white bars (they are normalization markers). Generally any wavelengths over that decibal level has the potential to distort on older CD players.

This track's final post production (as shown) is being mastered at -0.3dB as this is within the ideal range.

HAVE A LISTEN TO THE FINAL PRODUCT
Astral Projection - Mahadeva (Technix Mix) - 192/44 MP3

[Skyles]

^ just because adobe audition sets a threshold limit for it's audio, dosn't mean it's accurate. abobe also sets TV safe zones in photoshop and after effects, when in fact you have a wider zone to work with in a: dvd digital zone, and b: broadcast.

You have to understand that the tool your using is made to make you feel special... thats the key to software, you can trick people with the visual realm and distract them from what's really important, HOW IT SOUNDS!!

As for your final product, the high end is phasing out.. not major problem everyone does that.. But then again, I don't know anything about that type of music, so I shouldn't comment.. maybe thats how it's suppose to be, and thats what you wanted it to sound like. Mixing is subjective.

[Technix]

^ I'm actually looking for other mastering software in addition...any recommendations? Any specific tools you use?

[Skyles]

protools? cubase? Logic? i just use my sequencer, or record out of my board. If i play something out I throw an EQ then L3 on it to bring it up.

But there is something to be said about the seperation of frequencies when running through analogue gear. So if I can I'll record out of the board set it to some zones, then back in.. or onto another source.

But for serious stuff, I just do a dry mix, and send it off to a mastering house... like suite sound. Lets the pro's take care of it.