Slackware

[lildonkey]

God installing linux is a bitch, but once its done its soooo worth it :) who else is running linux ?

[miss.myra]

I have it on my computer and I sometimes use it (slackware) but I get lazy and frustrated and usually run windows (i know, that is contradictory..)

[sNyx]

buddy has a LUNIX inside avatar, so I assume he does ;)
I would, but fawk where is the software support? :n:

[specialkonrd]

slackware is dope i used to run it
i've run freebsd slackware redhat and im gonna be installin atheOS or BeOS on one of my comps

dont install slackware unless you plan to run a server though
very bad for a home OS
KDE and XWin both seem bloated and slow to me

[Tux]

u kno it :284: using slackware right now..

[specialkonrd]

Tux is also the name of the linux penguin

[dfltr]

i'm workin on a Gentoo install right now. just enough server to screw with and plenty of desktop too.

plus it's easy enough for an anti-admin coder for me to work with too :P

[Tux]

Originally posted by snyx™
buddy has a LUNIX inside avatar, so I assume he does ;)
I would, but fawk where is the software support? :n:

dude, theres TONS of software support.. theres a whole opensource community willing to help peeps with problems an shit. Mandrake especially, they have a good support forum for their distro, hell, i used to donate my time and worked as a "Mandrake Expert" for like 6 months helping people out with ALL linux software, and its not hard to find many other places for help... hey, and its FREE SOFTWARE... :smoke1:

[rawb]

linux/*bsd as a server = :)!

linux/*bsd as your main home box = :(!

[Tux]

Originally posted by rawb
linux/*bsd as a server = :)!

linux/*bsd as your main home box = :(!

y :(?? thats so not true.. more like :284: :)!!

[specialkonrd]

Theres no mainstream software support. You can use Windows emulators but those are really slow adn suck. It's a hassle to relearn your favorite programs. Theres no port of photoshop, no port of counterstrike (other then the server), very few game ports, ect...

It takes some dedication to run linux on ur main box.

[lildonkey]

im running it as my main, i deleted my windows partition so that it would force me to learn my way around linux :)

[Tux]

Originally posted by specialkonrd
Theres no mainstream software support.

Read my post above. but really, it is FREE software, so u get what u pay for... and if you BUY a linux distro from a store, it usually includes a few years of tech support.... not to mention its about half the cost of windows.

You can use Windows emulators but those are really slow adn suck.

you can use windows emulators IF you need to use windows-specific programs, but linux pretty much has the equivilent of every software package available on Windows, and a lot of the time they are even better than the windows equivelent... IF you really need to use a windows-specific program, just run it under
WINE, which does not slow anything down (some apps run even faster, in some cases), and is quite good now. Read this to clear up any other misconception you may have about WINE.

It's a hassle to relearn your favorite programs.

What would you have to relearn?? if you want to use the same apps as under windows, you can run them under WINE, and it will be the same, and some windows apps run under linux without being ported (mostly games which use OpenGL such as quake 3 arena, etc.)

Theres no port of photoshop

True. But Linux has The GIMP, which is the opensource free alternative to photoshop, and included all the same features and even more than photoshop.

no port of counterstrike (other then the server),

Half-Life and all mods for it run very well under linux using WINE.

very few game ports, ect...

untrue. Many software companies port their games to Linux, or use an opensource architecture such as OpenGL which is fully compatible with linux and can easily be used on it. As for games which are not ported by the game manufacturer, and you do not want to run under WINE for some reason even though it will most likely work and run the same without any noticable difference, Tux Games natively ports many new games to linux themselves and sells them for reasonable prices.

It takes some dedication to run linux on ur main box.

Depends. It only takes as much dedication to run linux as it does windows, even less so cause you dont have to deal with the constant threat of viruses, system crashes, and security issues. However, if your a programmer (such as myself), and LIKE to configure every little bit of your machine, then use an advanced linux distrobution such as slackware, debian, etc. which enables you to configure everything from scratch. Mandrake, Red Hat, and other similar distros however require the same amount of config. as windows, tho the option is there to configure them manually even more if you wish.

BTW, have you ever even USED linux? or just pick up these misconceptions elsewhere? :hehe:

[Rytalin]

What if Nix was an airline?


Everyone brings one piece of the aeroplane with them when they come to the airport. Then they all go out onto the runway and put the plane together piece by piece, arguing constantly about what kind of a plane they are building.

[specialkonrd]

Originally posted by Tux

BTW, have you ever even USED linux? or just pick up these misconceptions elsewhere? :hehe:

yes, ive USED linux and freebsd. And i'll say this much to lildonkey. You wont be too happy running that as your main OS. Especially if ur just JUMPING into it like you are now. It'll be fun at first but it'll get to you...the little things like how the windows minimize, ect.. It's all alot to get used to. You'll be completely lost if you dont know how to compile programs, ect.

And dude, who said we pay for software to begin with? I've bought like...halflife in the last 5 years, and just for the serial number.

I know linux has alot of free opensource software, but its still a matter of relearning everything. GiMP is alot different then photoshop. Theres all these fuckin wacky ICQ and MSN clients and all this shit to deal wiht too. Like i said, you have to be DEDICATED if you want to switch over to unix fully.

[specialkonrd]

oh and mike, hook it up wiht a shell heh

[lildonkey]

hrmm any help on installing java lol ?

[specialkonrd]

mike, download bitchX tomorow
get on efnet (when it opens, type /server irc.arcti.ca)
and /msg spec-k whassap

ill be installing slackware onto one of my comps tomorow so ill give you waht help i can over irc

[Tux]

Originally posted by lildonkey
hrmm any help on installing java lol ?

open up mozilla, go to http://cgi.netscape.com/cgi-bin/pi_m....cgi?PID=10048 and click the "click to download button.. it will download and install itself automatically. Then close mozilla, open it up again and Java should work, and be detected under Help>about plugins

[stringbeans]

im dual booting between winxp and redhat8 right now

im really happy with redhat8 as a desktop os and im going to delete that partition and try slackware during the summer...

as for how konrad said kde is bloated in slackware.. that's weird. if anything kde would be bare-bones in slackware and would run much faster

last summer i tried using linux and ONLY linux as my os to try and force me to learn it... it did help and i learned a lot but you dont learn as much as you really think you would. plus, everything in windows is so much more convenient so im sticking with the dual boot

john
2899131

[rawb]

you can use windows emulators IF you need to use windows-specific programs, but linux pretty much has the equivilent of every software package available on Windows, and a lot of the time they are even better than the windows equivelent...

Proper windows networking support, ntfs support, full microsoft office compatibility, quicktime, full flash support, illustration, movie editing...

having an equivalent isnt even close to having a full featured program.

linux is not ready for the desktop.

What would you have to relearn?? if you want to use the same apps as under windows, you can run them under WINE, and it will be the same, and some windows apps run under linux without being ported (mostly games which use OpenGL such as quake 3 arena, etc.)

yes but now you're running apps with the overhead of 2 operating systems.

True. But Linux has The GIMP, which is the opensource free alternative to photoshop, and included all the same features and even more than photoshop.

gimp is a very good program, but doesn't come close to photoshop for professional work.

untrue. Many software companies port their games to Linux, or use an opensource architecture such as OpenGL which is fully compatible with linux and can easily be used on it. As for games which are not ported by the game manufacturer, and you do not want to run under WINE for some reason even though it will most likely work and run the same without any noticable difference, Tux Games natively ports many new games to linux themselves and sells them for reasonable prices.

bs. most game companies now use directx and have cast off opengl. 99% of retail games do not have a linux port. and if they do it for pure curiosity, since making a linux port has never paid for itself on a retail level. just ask id. one company (loki) has already gone out of business porting games to linux. add also the fact the drivers for the newest video cards are always more stable and mature on windows, and you're really looking at no advantage.

Depends. It only takes as much dedication to run linux as it does windows, even less so cause you dont have to deal with the constant threat of viruses, system crashes, and security issues.

bull-fucking-shit. there were 2 critical sendmail issues in the last 2 weeks. there are large amounts of security issues coming out for linux and packages all the time. system crashes on my linux box happen probably about 3 or 4 times a year, which is about the same as my win2000 box i do dev on. the only reason there is no slammer-like worms for linux is because it isnt as prevailent as windows boxes. it has nothing to do with security.

the only advantage of security that linux has over windows is that patches for affected programs usually take hours instead of days.

winxp or 2k + cygwin lets me have all the compatibility of a windows box, with all of the industry standard programs, plus gives me a bash shell and gcc to compile in any packages i need to fuck around with. i honestly can't come up with any reasons why linux on my desktop is better than windows, apart from price (which obviously isn't a factor anyways, since you need a copy of windows to run wine with, which seems to be your answe to a lot of questions).

[Tux]

BAH!! i'll rip apart your post and point out the obvious inconsistencies and your overall wrongness when i get back from writing my math final...

[dfltr]

you had me up until the last few paragraphs rawb. it's true that the "you can use WINE" argument is weak. if i want to use something, i'll run it how it was meant to be run, not run a resource-crippled emulated version of it.

also, the gimp is cool, but nothing can top photoshop, illustrator, flash mx, and 3dsmax. you just can't set up a professional design platform on linux.

but as for security, i'd say they're balanced in terms of effort required. they both have patches coming out all the time... the only difference is that a constantly maintained linux server will actually be secure and perform well under a load.

[Tux]

Originally posted by rawb


Proper windows networking support, ntfs support, full microsoft office compatibility, quicktime, full flash support, illustration, movie editing...

uhhh.. not true. Crossover Office is an implementation of WINE which contains better support for some apps. Crossover Office has full compatibility with Microsoft Office, Quicktime, Flash, Shockwave, etc... although it is not free like WINE, it is usually included when you BUY a linux distro. And there is proper windows networking support in linux... linux supports basically all filesystems, and SAMBA provides excellent compatibility with windows based networks... there are also many linux applications used for movie editing by MANY move production studios.. to name a few who use linux:
Digital Domain
Disney
Double Negative
Dreamworks
Flash Film Works
Hammerhead
Industrial Light & Magic
Pixar
Rhythm & Hues
Sony Pictures
Tippett
Weta Digital
also, Linux has been used in the production of the following movies, just to name a few:

Dantes Peak [2/7/97] D2
Titanic [12/19/97] D2
Stuart Little [12/17/99] R&H
Little Nicky [11/10/00] R&H
Grinch [11/17/00] R&H
Sixth Day [11/17/00] R&H
Enemy at the Gates [3/16/01] Double Negative (England)
Cats & Dogs [4/4/01] R&H
Shrek [5/16/01] Dreamworks
Fast & the Furious [6/22/01] Hammerhead
Dr. Dolittle 2 [6/22/01] R&H
Final Fantasy [7/11/01] Square (ceased operations)
Planet of the Apes [7/27/01] R&H
Captain Corelli's Mandolin [9/17/01] Double Negative
Harry Potter [11/16/01] R&H
Lord of the Rings 1 [12/19/01] Weta
Collateral Damage [2/8/02] Flash Film Works
Blade II [3/22/02] Tippett
Death to Smoochy [3/29/02] Flash Film Works
Star Wars E2 [5/16/02] ILM
Spirit [5/24/02] Dreamworks
Scooby-Doo [6/14/01] Rhythm & Hues
Haunted Lighthouse (IMAX) [summer 2002 Busch Gardens] Island Fever
Men In Black 2 [7/3/02] Tippett (limited Linux, chase scene through Manhattan)
XXX [8/9/2002] D2
Pluto Nash [8/16/02] Flash Film Works
Blue Crush [8/16/02] Hammerhead
Below [Q3 02] Double Negative
Santa Clause 2 [11/1/02] Tippett
Star Trek Nemesis [12/13/02] D2
Lord of the Rings 2 [12/25/02] Weta (New Zealand)

some of the apps used to edit movies include:
Film Gimp,
Maya,
SoftImage,
Houdini,
Shake,
NUKE,
Renderman,
Blender,
POV-Ray
and some film studios have written their own proprietary applications for movie editing in linux as well.

having an equivalent isnt even close to having a full featured program.

equivelants ARE fully featured programs.

linux is not ready for the desktop.

hmm... thats funny, cause i've been using linux exclusively on my desktop AND my new laptop for over 4 years...

yes but now you're running apps with the overhead of 2 operating systems.

wtf?!?!? what 2 Os'es? YOU DO NOT NEED A WINDOWS INSTALLATION TO USE WINE... WINE IS AN IMPLEMENTATION OF THE WINDOWS API WITH 100% MICROSOFT FREE CODE...

gimp is a very good program, but doesn't come close to photoshop for professional work.

gimp is very powerful, and a great program.. in my experience i've found it to be almost exactly the same as photoshop, but with a few extra features such as scripting... the only disadvantage to the GIMP is it not having the CMYK colorspace, which only makes it unsuitable for professional print media, like large scale advertising and such, but this is being worked on by the GIMP team.. read this: Gimp vs. Photoshop

bs. most game companies now use directx and have cast off opengl. 99% of retail games do not have a linux port. and if they do it for pure curiosity, since making a linux port has never paid for itself on a retail level. just ask id. one company (loki) has already gone out of business porting games to linux. add also the fact the drivers for the newest video cards are always more stable and mature on windows, and you're really looking at no advantage.

BS!! id uses opengl for most if not all of their games, and all are playable under linux. MANY companies use OpenGL for all their games, and the ones who don't are stupid for doing so. y? because OpenGL is not proprietary and is used on virtually all platforms and OS'es, not leaving apps who fully support it in the confines of the MS world. OpenGL also has a hell of a lot better graphics than DirectX (look at quake 3 arena, RTCW, neverwinter nights, etc.) linux ports unprofitable? not true. then tell me, why is Bioware in the middle of porting Neverwinter nights to linux then? there is a large growing linux community who would gladly purchase a linux port of a popular game. Video card drivers are fine under linux... no problems at all... and they are just as stable and mature as windows ones, both Nvidia and ATI now provide their own linux drivers. NO ADVANTAGE?? your crazy.. is your name bill gates by any chance?

bull-fucking-shit. there were 2 critical sendmail issues in the last 2 weeks. there are large amounts of security issues coming out for linux and packages all the time. system crashes on my linux box happen probably about 3 or 4 times a year, which is about the same as my win2000 box i do dev on. the only reason there is no slammer-like worms for linux is because it isnt as prevailent as windows boxes. it has nothing to do with security.

hahaha.. your joking right? the reason why linux is so secure is because it is supported by an opensource community, so whenever a security issue is found, it is patched within a few hours max. with windows, i can name hundreds of ecurity issues with each version that remain unpatched... on average, it takes MS several months to never to patch holes up... and since MS is closed source, there are many holes that go unnoticed and undiscovered. And sure, linux has the odd virus, and there will prolly be more if it become the OS of choice for everyone, but really viruses are a non-issue for linux.. to understand why, i suggest you read URL=http://librenix.com/?inode=21]THIS[/url]. As for crashes, in 4 years, i've only had maybe 5 crashes, and i do a lot of development, compiling, and config stuff on my machine.. because of the structure of linux, it is usually only an application or graphical Xfree86 layer which crashes, and just requires you to go to console to restart it without restarting your comp. I have only had 1 total system crash and that was caused of a bug in the SETI@home client.

the only advantage of security that linux has over windows is that patches for affected programs usually take hours instead of days.

true, it only does take a few hours for patches in linux apps, but days for MS??? no way.. they hardly ever fix and security holes or bugs in their products and when they do it is a crappy implementation at that...

winxp or 2k + cygwin lets me have all the compatibility of a windows box, with all of the industry standard programs, plus gives me a bash shell and gcc to compile in any packages i need to fuck around with. i honestly can't come up with any reasons why linux on my desktop is better than windows, apart from price (which obviously isn't a factor anyways, since you need a copy of windows to run wine with, which seems to be your answe to a lot of questions).

i can come up with a million reasons why linux is better... and i already gave you a few... AND WTF??? YOU DO NOT NEED WINDOWS TO RUN WINE! and i find it funny that you are using cygwin (an implementation of *nix on windows) when WINE is essentially the the same thing but opposite... anyways.... winblows is a joke..

[lildonkey]

God damn this debate is getting good.... One thing i've noticed as well... is that on irc on many servers, people are more then happy to help.... like are more then 20 linux channels on effnet and you can pretty much as a question in any of the channels and get a responce.. wheras i found it difficult to get support about issues when i was on windows... maybe because since linux is opensource it helps the people understand it more thus making it easier to help people? I dunno though im still a newbie.. but im loving slackware :)


Oh yah and quick question... i don't like people seeing my hostname on irc because i get portscanned like every 2 seconds in a linux channel... any tutorial on ip spoofing?