Swing Kids/Ravers

[Vitamin~J]

Hey, I'm bored and totally procrasinating on a huge paper I gotta write, and I thought I'd make a post...

Has anyone else seen the movie Swing Kids? For people that havent, basically its set in Nazi Germany, and there are ungerground swing parties, that these kids go to, and rebel against the Nazi Regime...

I kinda thought it was cool that Raves are kinda like those Swing Dances of the 21st century... Well thats at least how I kinda view them as... Raves are somewhere to go for me, to jam to music, and dance to express myself, much like the Swing Kids did...

Just curious, What do u guys think? What to raves mean to you?

[shorerider]

Originally posted by Vitamin~J
Has anyone else seen the movie Swing Kids? For people that havent, basically its set in Nazi Germany, and there are ungerground swing parties, that these kids go to, and rebel against the Nazi Regime...

I kinda thought it was cool that Raves are kinda like those Swing Dances of the 21st century... Well thats at least how I kinda view them as... Raves are somewhere to go for me, to jam to music, and dance to express myself, much like the Swing Kids did...

I don't see the relationship, as the swing kids were Jewish and were always under the threat of being put in concentration camps, being shot, enough food to eat and so on.

[Mr Ektion]

I connect nazi's with swing kids all the time. ah ha!

i'm just joking. basically any party where people come together to just kick it and dance is a rave. just gotta go all night and have live music.

[miss.myra]

Well..I'd compare the genre 'northern soul' (the flirtations, denise lasalle, detriot emeralds...it's motown-esque) and its movement in the late sixties to today's 'raving'
all around the USA people (primarily black) were taking amphetamines and staying up all night dancing to this music...

[decypher]

wasen't raves 20 years ago once a rebelling against copyrights and mainstream music? heh times change

[mojo]

typically though it has too be the oontz oontz music

[matéo]

I was under the impression that raves were started by blacks and gays in the 70's if you want to include those all nite parties into rave history.

[Vitamin~J]

Originally posted by shorerider


I don't see the relationship, as the swing kids were Jewish and were always under the threat of being put in concentration camps, being shot, enough food to eat and so on.

actually the swing kids were NOT jewish, they were just german kids wanting to listen to their own music... for example when 2 of the swing kids are forced join the Junior SS...
and of course im not saying they are exactly the same... just simliar... u know :)

[Veni*C]

if you can grab a copy of "last night a dj saved my life"....it wil help you alot...it explains alot of what your wanting to know....awsome read tooo! :kimmie:

[finger_7]

The swing scene of the mid 40's and modern raves are not so far off. Both scenes are underground and like modern day we still have the "law" storming into our parties and/or dispersing them. The original intent of both scenes was to have a place for young ppl to go underground in defiance of the powers that be, dance and enjoy good music. I'd agree totally that there is somewhat of a relation between the two. Good Call Vitamin~J.

:shades1:Fin

[Vitamin~J]

^
thanks dude! yeah, that's what i totally noticed as well...
"place for young ppl to go underground in defiance of the powers that be, dance and enjoy good music."
good description!

It just kinda made me think about it when I went to Lucid Dream this weekend... Cops did show, but fortunatly were pretty cool with it... unlike back in the 40's when u'd get ur ass kicked, arressted and shipped off to a camp somwhere... goes to show you how fortunate we are these days...

[Vitamin~J]

But yeah, the point of this thread wasnt really to discuss the two era's, but rather share what raves mean to you... why do you go to them?

hopefully not to see the young 15 year olds in skimpy clothing... but we wont go there.... so straight up... WHY DO U RAVE?

[SEAN!]

Originally posted by mojo
typically though it has too be the oontz oontz music

ONNTZZ ONNTZZ ONNTTZZ!!!

[inkster]

http://www.t0.or.at/hakimbey/taz/taz3a.htm

this'll be a good place to start.

[Vitamin~J]

^ what the hell is that, I was too lazy to really read any of it...

[robyn]

I don't think you can compare the two. I mean, the swing kids you're talking about were living in NAZI FUCKING GERMANY! What powers that be is you average raver up against?

[Vitamin~J]

^ :338: obviously u didnt read finger_7s post... it wasnt the fact that they were doing it to piss the Nazi's off... it was the fact that they were dancing for their own enjoyment, but were being prosecuted by doing so...

Just like kids can be often prosecuted now... When u tell an average person that u go to raves... whats ur usual response... "Oh so you're one of those kids that do drugs and listen to that devil techno music..."

Just like kids back then... Oh you listen to that black and jew music, and go to those awful swing parties...

It was underground, with kids dancing to music,... rave anyone?
Again, im not saying their exactly the same... but similar...

and I think ur missing the point, the point was to find out why people rave?

[Technique]

Originally posted by Vitamin~J
^
Just like kids can be often prosecuted now... When u tell an average person that u go to raves... whats ur usual response... "Oh so you're one of those kids that do drugs and listen to that devil techno music..."

LMAO

devil techno music!

[Vitamin~J]

^ hehehe its true! People have such a stigma attached to the music and the scene in general!

[finger_7]

Originally posted by robyn
I don't think you can compare the two. I mean, the swing kids you're talking about were living in NAZI FUCKING GERMANY! What powers that be is you average raver up against?

Fair enough, I'll elaborate a little further here...

The "average raver" is up against the greater portion of society that by all rights believes what we do is wrong. We have an illusion of rights, freedoms and amendments in north america that do not include the absolute freedom to gather in a public place to listen to what we want and legally party as we want. Raving is something not acceptable by those who write, defend or enforce the law, or by the "good" people in society that will abhor raving and then head to their local pub to poison themselves beyond recognition in an "acceptable" fashion. Therefore, to rave is to embrace your absolute freedom for an evening, to defy the trappings of society, your everyday job, or the system itself and dance and enjoy music and hang with those people who carry the same free spirit as you somewhere where the law can not reach. It's a temporary euphoric escape of sorts and that's how I view it.

Sure, we are very lucky to not need face death and persecution as the kids in the 40's did, but death of the spirit, and of your absolute freedom to do whatever you wish (as long as it brings no harm to anyone else) is no different.

[skittled]

Try partying in the states. You don't get throwns into concertation camps or beaten up but its really harsh down there. promoters can get huge fine like 100g"s if the police think they are facilating drug dealers and like someone posted some where else on fnk, djs in new york stop the music and tell people to put there smoke before the music starts again so they don't get shut down by by inspectors. I can't believe how awesome it is to party here in canada espicially out in toronto or montreal way better vibes at the parties but that just my thoughts but ya good call on the similarities between the 2 scenes

[rawb]

if i read another rant where someone tries to liken raving to some counter-cultural/underground/historicly-relevant movement i think im going to scream.

raving is big business, socially accepted, and not political in any way. if i go to a loft party with a punk band im not all of a sudden RAGING AGAINST THE MACHINE or STARTING A NEW ERA OF CONSCIOUSNESS.

as soon as you feel the need to validate yourself within a social subgroup you should be looking at your reasons. just go out and have fun and save the bullshit navel gazing for the next generation.

it's dance music, get over it. 'the man' is either hired for, or shows up once at almost every party. no one cares.

[djmarkpaul]

myra: Damn it, I was thinking "nothern soul" too but j00 pwned teh 1337ness 1n d155 thr34d...poop on a stick.

Rawb: You make some good points but I disagree with you in the premise of "validating"...I think that's just part of finding yourself.

It seems you have to a degree, and good on you, but some people don't settle and maybe they shouldn't. There's a catch 22 when you said "just go out and have fun and save the bullshit navel gazing for the next generation" after "as soon as you feel the need to validate yourself within a social subgroup you should be looking at your reasons." So question yourself for navel gazing but don't navel gaze? That's like saying Jackson should pass the kids over to Kobe.

...

The "rave" scene maybe started for a group of outsiders, but all that has changed. Maybe it's time for a new word. Quips?

[jomama]

when im at a party i feel home

[ebbomega]

Alright. If a rave gets busted, we don't have a bunch of people running in, cracking skulls open and sending everybody off to work camps. The party is shut down and everybody is asked to go home. So to compare yourself with the kids growing up in Nazi Germany seems to prump your character up a bit more than it deserves, wouldn't you say?

Raves have _many_ points of origin, and some could argue that Greek Wine orgies may mark the first raves. Frankly, the way I see it, it was derived mostly from the gay club scene in Chicago in the 80s, which in turn was derived from the Disco scene, which in turn was derived from the Gay Club scene in the early 70's and 60's. Furthermore, a lot of the drug use comes from the "Acid Tests" started by Ken Kesey, The Grateful Dead and the Merry Pranksters in the 60's. This also ties it all in with the Hell's Angels as well. The whole "PLUR" thing was a sad sad simplification of the whole general let's-just-party-and-not-care-who-we-party-with attitude. That one specifically came out of the black gay club culture that's been kicking around for quite a long time.

Finally, Vitamin-J, if you're willing to give a discourse on what "raving" is but refuse to read one of the generally accepted doctrines (being Bey's "TAZ") then I have to say that sadly enough your theories are going to be filed under "uneducated opinion" and won't be treated with much credibility by those who understand what's going on...