Strategic Voting!?!?!?!

[fable]

Okay, so perhaps its because i have some major biases the size of whistler mountain, pertaining to the convaluted muck we call a democratic electionary process in this country, because i really need someone to give me a rationale on the current buzzword known as "strategic voting"

My question also revolves around a few realities (or seem real to me)

- the sentiment revolving around the idea of needing to strategically vote, so as to not have a conservative majority, essentially meaning to vote liberal? If its a strategic vote, then why not NDP? In every conversation ive had, and heard, and from the general consensus to the few all candidates meetings ive been to thus far, it seems that "strategically voting" specifically means voting liberal?

-If we are seeking to unite the left in this country, then why would the green party be an option? They dont even have a complete platform!?!?! Neither do they even come close to having a large working class support base!

-How do BOTH our communist parties support Indegenous self determination and support a democtatic beoujoix revolution, AND support Canadian nationalism? Does this seem ridicously contridictory to anyone else?

[Two_Six]

I dunno but I am voting for The Liberals, I don't share the same views as The Conservatie party. The Liberals are the only party I want to vote for, no point voting for NDP cause they don't have a chance in winning. Green party no thanks.

[Cdn_Brdr]

^I think a point that is trying to be made is that if EVERYONE who truly WANTED to vote NDP actually did then they would have a far better chance than they do.

I was contemplating a so called 'strategic vote' but the more I think about it the more I'm opposed to the idea. I know for a fact that the Tories are going to win my riding. There is no doubt at all. I live in an area of old, rich yuppies. They all ACT like they're the most right leaning people out there (read: GOOD CHRISTIANS) but when you get down to it they're only GOOD on Sundays. Hypocrites really.

The thing is, each vote you place to the party of your favour also translates to funding for said party. Basically, even if the party you support doesn't win you are still helping them out in the long run.

The biggest shame is that if the majority of young people actually took the time to care/vote then there'd be a far better chance for the NDP to win. The majority of people I know are left-leaning, working class people who would benefit from an NDP gov't. Problem is a lot of them feel their vote won't really count for much.

I know the cliche "Don't vote? Don't complain" is argued a lot but I really believe that to a certain degree it rings true. While your right to bitch can't really be stripped away you sure as hell can't say much about a ruling gov't that pisses you off if you didn't at least do your part to TRY and change the outcome.

Just my 2cents :)

[miss.myra]

fable, aren't you not planning on voting in this election at all?

[sidekick]

Originally Posted by fable

- the sentiment revolving around the idea of needing to strategically vote, so as to not have a conservative majority, essentially meaning to vote liberal? If its a strategic vote, then why not NDP?

and you've just touched on the main problem of strategic voting. that it means different things to different people: to some it means voting NDP as strategy in their riding, and to others it means voting liberal in that same riding. the only way it will work is if they have a meeting and all decide to vote the same way.

-If we are seeking to unite the left in this country, then why would the green party be an option? They dont even have a complete platform!?!?! Neither do they even come close to having a large working class support base!

i don't think that's fair, seeing as it's not true. they may not have as extensive a platform as the liberals or conservatives, but they have a pretty complete platform with issues surrounding affordable housing, healthcare, education, aboriginal rights, environment, arts and culture funding, etc...

http://www.greenparty.ca/platform_20...n=141:141.html

i'm not voting green, but it's not fair to say their platform isn't complete.

[esoter1c]

Those who vote ndp will only help the Cons win.

If everyone planning on voting ndp voted Liberal the Cons would lose.

From the loox of things the Cons will win.

And no I don't vote because I refuse to be a part of this bullshit fucked up system.

If the Greens had even a slight chance I would be first in line to vote for them.

Fuck politrix neways they're all fuckin scum liars.

[sidekick]

Originally Posted by 3507321C

Those who vote ndp will only help the Cons win.

If everyone planning on voting ndp voted Liberal the Cons would lose.

that is such a bullshit strategy. it doesn't even make sense, you even say why in your post. you say 'if everyone'. yes....EVERYONE. but you don't know if everyone voting NDP are going to vote Liberal as their strategy. in some ridings the NDP candidate is the one that is closer to beating out the conservatives, so it would 'strategically' make more sense to vote for them if you don't want the conservatives to win.

the problem is that not 'everyone' knows which candidate has the better chance of beating the conservative candidate in their riding. it's NOT always the liberal candidate.

[esoter1c]

Originally Posted by Sidekick

that is such a bullshit strategy. it doesn't even make sense, you even say why in your post. you say 'if everyone'. yes....EVERYONE. but you don't know if everyone voting NDP are going to vote Liberal as their strategy. in some ridings the NDP candidate is the one that is closer to beating out the conservatives, so it would 'strategically' make more sense to vote for them if you don't want the conservatives to win.

the problem is that not 'everyone' knows which candidate has the better chance of beating the conservative candidate in their riding. it's NOT always the liberal candidate.

From what the news is showing ndp is behind Liberals, overall.

I couldn't really care less about Canadian politics.

West coast is just Ottawas bitch all they do is rape us and cut our health/education/everything.

Fuck Ottawa.

I wish that the Amerodollar would just hurry the fuck up.

[sidekick]

Originally Posted by 3507321C

From what the news is showing ndp is behind Liberals, overall.

overall polls have nothing to do with which candidate will win in certain ridings. just because the NDP are behind the liberals in the national polls doesn't mean that the Liberals have a better chance in beating out the conservatives in every single riding. strategic voting doesn't work nationally, but only in your own riding...and it doesn't even work there unless everyone does the same thing.

I couldn't really care less about Canadian politics.

not surprising considering everytime you post something about canadian politics it doesn't make sense.

[esoter1c]

Originally Posted by Sidekick

overall polls have nothing to do with which candidate will win in certain ridings. just because the NDP are behind the liberals in the national polls doesn't mean that the Liberals have a better chance in beating out the conservatives in every single riding. strategic voting doesn't work nationally, but only in your own riding...and it doesn't even work there unless everyone does the same thing.



not surprising considering everytime you post something about canadian politics it doesn't make sense.

West coast is just Ottawas bitch all they do is rape us and cut our health/education/everything.

If that doesn't make sense to you then you're a gimp.:285:

[Draven GD]

ok i can understand all the conservitive bashing, but what the hell is going on with all this liberal simpathy. doesnt make any sence. the worst thing i can think of the liberals staying in power. i will vote NDP. i realize that there is little chance they will win. but as said before it will help in the long run. and if more people like me place there votes behind NDP insted of trying to vote for someone they think has a chance of winning then NDP would have just as much support as liberals.
you know to be honest, i dont care who wins this election. i dont want it to be liberals, but i have to accsept the fact that that may very well be the outcome. but what i care about is the positioning of the NDP party. for working as an opposition, and for prepairing for the next election.
i figgure eventualy the liberals and conservative will both show that they cant run a country.
im waiting for that day when Canadains stop listening to all the hype about strategic voting and actualy place there vote behind the person that will actualy be a leader for Canada!

[fable]

Originally Posted by Cdn_Brdr

^I think a point that is trying to be made is that if EVERYONE who truly WANTED to vote NDP actually did then they would have a far better chance than they do.

I was contemplating a so called 'strategic vote' but the more I think about it the more I'm opposed to the idea. I know for a fact that the Tories are going to win my riding. There is no doubt at all. I live in an area of old, rich yuppies. They all ACT like they're the most right leaning people out there (read: GOOD CHRISTIANS) but when you get down to it they're only GOOD on Sundays. Hypocrites really.

The thing is, each vote you place to the party of your favour also translates to funding for said party. Basically, even if the party you support doesn't win you are still helping them out in the long run.

The biggest shame is that if the majority of young people actually took the time to care/vote then there'd be a far better chance for the NDP to win. The majority of people I know are left-leaning, working class people who would benefit from an NDP gov't. Problem is a lot of them feel their vote won't really count for much.

I know the cliche "Don't vote? Don't complain" is argued a lot but I really believe that to a certain degree it rings true. While your right to bitch can't really be stripped away you sure as hell can't say much about a ruling gov't that pisses you off if you didn't at least do your part to TRY and change the outcome.

Just my 2cents :)

Either hell has frozen over, or i am pleasently getting my own snap judgments served back to me on a platter, because i agree with EVERYTHING YOU JUST SAID 100%.

pc + eez

[fable]

Originally Posted by Sidekick

and you've just touched on the main problem of strategic voting. that it means different things to different people: to some it means voting NDP as strategy in their riding, and to others it means voting liberal in that same riding. the only way it will work is if they have a meeting and all decide to vote the same way.



i don't think that's fair, seeing as it's not true. they may not have as extensive a platform as the liberals or conservatives, but they have a pretty complete platform with issues surrounding affordable housing, healthcare, education, aboriginal rights, environment, arts and culture funding, etc...

http://www.greenparty.ca/platform_20...n=141:141.html

i'm not voting green, but it's not fair to say their platform isn't complete.

fair!? Perhaps i should said "their current platform, seems extremely unfocussed and vague"

[fable]

Originally Posted by miss.myra

fable, aren't you not planning on voting in this election at all?

im voting NDP hun.

[Asheai]

Originally Posted by Dravengd

ok i can understand all the conservitive bashing, but what the hell is going on with all this liberal simpathy. doesnt make any sence. the worst thing i can think of the liberals staying in power. i will vote NDP. i realize that there is little chance they will win. but as said before it will help in the long run. and if more people like me place there votes behind NDP insted of trying to vote for someone they think has a chance of winning then NDP would have just as much support as liberals.
you know to be honest, i dont care who wins this election. i dont want it to be liberals, but i have to accsept the fact that that may very well be the outcome. but what i care about is the positioning of the NDP party. for working as an opposition, and for prepairing for the next election.
i figgure eventualy the liberals and conservative will both show that they cant run a country.
im waiting for that day when Canadains stop listening to all the hype about strategic voting and actualy place there vote behind the person that will actualy be a leader for Canada!

some very good points, I agree with you..... I was very undecided between the liberals and the NDP and now I think I will just go with what I believe in (the NDPs) and fuck the conservatives... Canada will (hopefully) realize what a mistake they made putting them in to power... the only bad thing is if they actually suceed (that would suck).

[Cdn_Brdr]

Originally Posted by fable

Either hell has frozen over, or i am pleasently getting my own snap judgments served back to me on a platter, because i agree with EVERYTHING YOU JUST SAID 100%.

pc + eez

Hmmmm..... I have noticed it is a LITTLE chilly today.

[Ree Fresh]

In North Vancouver there is no chance of the NDP or Green getting in. Although I do like our Liberal candadate... I dont want to take any chances of the conservative party getting in at all!

[Ree Fresh]

Originally Posted by Dravengd

ok i can understand all the conservitive bashing, but what the hell is going on with all this liberal simpathy. doesnt make any sence. the worst thing i can think of the liberals staying in power. i will vote NDP. i realize that there is little chance they will win. but as said before it will help in the long run. and if more people like me place there votes behind NDP insted of trying to vote for someone they think has a chance of winning then NDP would have just as much support as liberals.
you know to be honest, i dont care who wins this election. i dont want it to be liberals, but i have to accsept the fact that that may very well be the outcome. but what i care about is the positioning of the NDP party. for working as an opposition, and for prepairing for the next election.
i figgure eventualy the liberals and conservative will both show that they cant run a country.
im waiting for that day when Canadains stop listening to all the hype about strategic voting and actualy place there vote behind the person that will actualy be a leader for Canada!

I dont trust or really respect any party... its like the episode of south park were you have to choose between a turd sandwich or a gian doosh.

No party is going to be 100% of what they say. We all know what manipulitve liars they ALL are.

As much as I am for all the social responsibilty the NDP would bring to our ppl (wich we need more of) I dont think the NDP can really take care of the ecanomics part.

Looking at whats best for all of Canada... I think the Liberals have been doing a decently good job. I much rather see are country grow in a steady ballenced party than swing back and forth from a left to right party in power.

I think I rather see the Liberals in power Nationaly... and prefer the NDP see power provicaly instead.

[laska]

This might already have been said here, but I think the strategic voting that most people are talking about right now is this:

1. The Liberals need to be out of power for a least a term. They've gotten too confident. They need a modesty check!

2. The only plausible way to get them out is to get the Tories in

3. With a minority gov't Harper won't actually be able to do all the scarry stuff he's talking about anyway

4. Next election, get the new and improved Liberals back!

[(val)Liam]

even though the NDP won't win, they're a very useful party in minority government situations... if they are the party that holds the government together, they can make sure the government doesn't try to completely fuck us... but what I fear is a conservative minority government held together by the bloc...

[miss.myra]

Originally Posted by laska

This might already have been said here, but I think the strategic voting that most people are talking about right now is this:

1. The Liberals need to be out of power for a least a term. They've gotten too confident. They need a modesty check!

Yeah all we can do is say goodbye to gay marriage, abortions, turn Canada into much more of a US millitary ally and send the country into economic crisis by doing silly things like reducing GST without doing anything to gain that money back.

Brilliant idea for a modesty check.

[fable]

Originally Posted by miss.myra

Yeah all we can do is say goodbye to gay marriage, abortions, turn Canada into much more of a US millitary ally and send the country into economic crisis by doing silly things like reducing GST without doing anything to gain that money back.

Brilliant idea for a modesty check.

get a grip!
ndp :)

[stringbeans]

FUCK CANADA

[LDUB]

Originally Posted by laska

3. With a minority gov't Harper won't actually be able to do all the scarry stuff he's talking about anyway

Except that there is a chance that they may get a majority...

I think your thought process here is worse than the strategic voting that fables going on about.

Although polls are somewhat accurate they can never completely predict the outcome. (I lie to anyone that calls me just to get them to stop calling me...) If you are willing to risk a Harper majority just to teach the liberals a lesson then by all means.

Vote for who you want. Like Sidekick says strategic voting only works if it's widespread.

Personally I've already voted... I'm just hoping that something drastic changes before the majority vote to change Canada for the worst.

[sidekick]

Originally Posted by miss.myra

Yeah all we can do is say goodbye to gay marriage, abortions, turn Canada into much more of a US millitary ally and send the country into economic crisis by doing silly things like reducing GST without doing anything to gain that money back.

i really don't think we are going to have to say goodbye to same-sex marriage. harper has said that he will have a free vote and even if that free vote goes the way against same-sex marriage there is still the supreme court and the consitution that are in favour of it...and on this issue the supreme court has a higher power than the government because it is a human rights issue.

as for the GST cut harper is apparently financing it through higher taxes on the lower income brackets and hoping for a surplus in the economy to pay for it...which i think is pretty idiotic; especially the taxes on the lowest income bracket.

fuck the conservatives and their fucked up idea of what canada should be.