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| Punching Bag Bitch, cry and whine your way into oblivion. |
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Oct 10, 05
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Teachers Strike
ok.. my mom is a teacher... has been for 30 years now.. and it sucks.. it's scary to think that she might be fined for this
so many people don't understand the reason why they are doing it. It's so frustrating to open the paper and read comments from the public such as : -"It's all about the money." I am thoroughly disgusted with the teachers of this province. Shame on you for your childish actions. To Jinny Sims; We, the parents of the children you are screwing up, don't support your actions, and we find you a childish bully who is holding our kids hostage. Stop trying to muddy the waters with talk of class size and conditions. You have no control over that. And stop pretending that it's not about money." Lanny Johnston, Burnaby. This person i would like to knock some sense into. I could understand that this person probably has one teacher in mind when they state these comments.. But most people dont realize how much a teacher has to deal with. I guess i understand because i see what my mom does and how hard she works in class AND outside of class.. things that she doesn't have to do, things she doesn't have to spend her own money on, but she does for the students so that they take more interest in their learning. She has to deal with little bratty kids who disturb class and whatnot.. gives them a warning and then sends them into the hall. Then their parents come along and are upset with her because their "little angel" is put in the hall.. or whatever.. my mom has had to deal with hells angels kids.. shes had to deal with threats from drugged out alcholic parents. ."you better watch it, i'll find where you live.. dadadada.." so on and so forth. Things that aren't really intitled to her job.. Parents who want their child to be treated in a specific way ..well she can't do that if they are loading the classes full with 30+ kids.. then she gets the shit from the parents.. and for someone like my mom, who is a happy go lucky, bouncy, sensibley sweet lady, to get threatened in any way is absolutely ridiculous. i don't know.. sorry about the rant but it's just really frustrating to have this happen to someone who works so hard.. and she's trying to prepare for retirement and everything.. it's just a shitty deal.. 
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Oct 10, 05
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i don't think anyone really knows the answer to that... all i know is that if the teachers don't go back as of thursday.. all the teachers are getting charged and fined..
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Oct 10, 05
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Im not a teacher, But 100% understand.
This is why ppl have to be so carful when watching the news and reading the papers. The media is extreamly manipulative and can pick and choose what to put on tv. I hardly ever see the news bring up the fact that the goverment has made a Legislative agreement... meaning that the teachers have been forced to sighn the contract with out any chance to nagociate. However thats the news and they do the same thing when it comes to election time. My biggest question is how can you make the teachers an esecial service... yet the bus drivers can strike for months and months!?!?! Teachers arnt baby sitters. And silly enough, although alot of parents are going crazy having to take off work... they dont seem to think that everyone in the BCTF and CUPE arnt suffering either while this strike is on? No one wants this stike to go on for long, but I hope they get something out of it.
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Oct 10, 05
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Funny enough they think they can fine the teachers... but it took them over 2 years to finaly give us our pay equity. Even then we still dont get it all... and they want to call the teachers criminals??? OH SNAP!
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Oct 10, 05
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having just got out of highschool my self, i can DEFINATELY say class sizes are getting really rediculous.
the lack of respect the teachers endure and still manage some how to drag themselves into work every morning AMAZES me. and really, missing these few days of school isn't screwing up ANYONE.... (if it was MONTHS then yes, i could see it being an issue.) its for the good of a change that needs to happen. furthermore, i don't see these charges/fines being plausable or going through at all. what happens when everyone refuses to pay? is the government going to throw ALL the teachers into jail and revoke their right to teach? i think not. however, i fear that more people will assume this the fault of the teachers and not the evil doings of our fucking liberal govt. then what happens when the outcry from the public is so great that the teachers will have to fold and go back to work no matter what the government decides? rock and a hard place. makes me very angry.
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Oct 10, 05
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1 point for irony. 1 point for you looking like an ass seeing as how she has a legitimate excuse not to be able to spell perfectly (that's okay, I did it once myself.) funny thing is, the excuse she has not to spell so great is exactly what makes her passionate about what she does. shame on you. kindly insert foot into mouth.
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Oct 10, 05
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^you counted 12 errors....
holy fuck man, get some fresh air already
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Oct 11, 05
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A lot of the teachers are more worried about the collapse of the union, which is a very real possibility if Gordo starts fining people.
The teachers union needs a lot of support from other unions to make it through this. I'd say their best bet would be the Teamsters and Auto Workers Union, which are probably the two largest in BC. A completely shut down would give them a great deal of leverage when dealing with Mr. Campbell.
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Oct 11, 05
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im personally so wish-washy on this situation it drives myself crazy. right now cause my dad is ill, my mom is our main income. shes a caretaker so shes with cupe. my mom gets no pay during the strike because cupe isnt striking. if she shows up to suport the teachers picket line she makes a total of $10 a day. basically the cost in gas to get to where she works.
so from a personal selfish view, the strike really fucking sucks and i wish it wasnt happening. my mom has ben with cupe for a long time working other support staff jobs with the school board, and they (especailly the caretakers) have been fucked over numerous times with their wages. when they have threatened to strike, they receive no public support. why? they're just janitors. that pisses me off, but gives me reason to put my fist in the air for the teachers in that hopefully with their walkout, the gov't will smarten the fuck up when it comes to all aspects of our childrens education. i just dont see where the money from our fucking taxes is going. healthcare? being someone whos family is divulged deeply into our system, getting to know nurses on a personal level, ive learned just how little it seems that our tax dollars go into healthcare. education? this strike is proving some what that the money at least is not going into the right places, and last year college support staff workers were on strike so the funding there is fucked up as welll. so where could all of our money be going? arent the liberals talking about all their fancy surpluses? oh wait. i forgot. the 2010 olympics. Last edited by mugsy; Oct 11, 05 at 06:25 PM.
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Oct 11, 05
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i hate political drama. the liberals are acting outrageous, they have shafted every unionized public service out there. and i'm glad the teachers, hospital workers, telus people, heck everyone! is on strike right now. not only do the teachers deserve a salary increase (because they haven't had one in for-ever), but the kids stuck in the system deserve better than to be stuck in classrooms with desks falling apart infront of them and 42 people class sizes that overflow the room! no one should be mad at the teachers, unless they support the way things are heading. TO HELL. just give the workers what they want, stop acting so childish when the budget your working with could deffinately shift a few decimals around to give more to the educated educators that have earned it.
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Oct 11, 05
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And the part about bering charged and fined.. well it's pretty scary to know that she is still so young at 25 and she might have a criminal record or something along those lines. It's not going to look very good on her resume. :( However if she doesn't picket then she will look bad and then get worse from there. *sigh*
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Oct 11, 05
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While I support the teachers in their concerns, I think the union is fucked and has too much power.
The BC College of Teachers needs to play a larger role in the system. The organizational structure needs to be more like the nurses have organized themselves. They have the RNABC, which is soon to be called the College of Registered Nurses, which is responsible for setting standards of practice, regulating the nurses, and is the governing body that is accountable to the public (in this case, for the teachers, that public would be the students). They're the ones who discipline and revoke licenses when there's a need. Then they have the BCNU, which is the union. They are only responsible for making sure there are fair wages, and that the nurses don't have crazy nurse:patient ratios. And really, that's all a union should be responsible for. In order for the teachers to be successful (and they haven't successfully negotiated a new contract in over a decade), they need public support. This should be the responsibility of the BC College of Teachers. They need to play a larger role in commissioning studies that show that larger class sizes are harmful to the kids they teach. They need to be more proactive in discipline cases, and show the public that teachers don't just get free ride to their pensions once they get hired. They need to show the public that they're working for the public. The union doesn't have to do that because they don't have anything to do with the public. The teacher's union only cares about one thing, and that's not their fault at all because unions are supposed to care for their members, and everything else is secondary. The only way for the teachers to make any changes (if they insist that they're doing this for the kids), is to make the BC College of Teachers step up and do their job, and make the union take a step down and respect their role.
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Oct 11, 05
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There is much ignorance on both sides...
2000-2001 Average Class size: 23.4 Students
2001-2002 Average Class size: 23.4 Students 2002-2003 Average Class size: 24.1 Students 2003-2004 Average Class size: 23.9 Students 2004-2005 Average Class size: 23.8 Students These are the Vancouver School Board Numbers. In the 5 years since the Liberals took power the average class size has increased by 0.4 students. While there may be anecdotal evidence of a high number of students in a class, it certainly is not the norm. The BCTF likes to say that removing class size limits from the collective bargaining agreement will hurt children and students. The numbers simply don't bear that out. Regarding "Essential Service" legislation: firefighters, police officers, ferry workers, nurses, doctors and many others are all covered by similar legislation. Why? Because all of those parties have a monopoly. In BC you cannot go to another brand of hospital with a different union while another is on strike. A BC-wide collective agreement allows for any of these professions to literally kill or financially ruin a massive amount of people simply because they are unhappy with their work conditions. On balance, the public interest is served by this essential service legislation. Quote:
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Whether you agree with the teacher's position or not, the fact remains that the Labour Relations Board ruled the strike illegal. The Provincial Supreme Court ordered the BCTF to return to work by thursday or be in contempt of court. Another important thing to consider in this dispute and the claims being made by the BCTF are the results of student achievement. Since the BCTF claims that larger class sizes are detrimental to students and that education has suffered since the BC Liberals have taken power, it is puzzling to me to look at the numbers. Every year FSA Tests (Foundation Skills Assessments Tests) are conducted in Grades 4-7. Literacy and numeracy are both up between 3-11% depending on the grade. High school completion overall is up 3%. Aboriginal high school completion is up 5%. ESL high school completion is up 5%. The numbers with respect to class sizes are over-stated by the union. The average class size increase in the past 5 years is 0.6 students. The effect that this government has had on education is inaccurate. By every measure of scholastic excellance we have, students are doing better. Perhaps the BCTF would do well to base their arguements on the facts, rather than rhetoric. Perhaps then the public would support the BCTF. Disclaimer: Nothing I have stated in this post was intended as a slight on teachers. It is a critique of their union leadership. Last edited by Esoteric; Oct 11, 05 at 01:34 PM.
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Oct 11, 05
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So does this involve post secondary instructors now?
edit:I go to bcit and one of my classes is taken at the surrey campus whcih is actually Princess Margerat Highschool and that class is cancelled due to this strike(can't cross picket lines) . So right now the teachers aren't on my good side regardless of what the issue is. This means my midterm is going to be November 1st instead of next week which really fucks me up since I am moving into a new house on Oct31. Last edited by matéo; Oct 11, 05 at 02:28 PM.
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Oct 11, 05
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Where did you find these stats?
I’m in agreeance that union leadership is indeed corrupt, self serving and inane. But first we support the union in its entirety, after changes are made, and the government stops pulling out the legislation card on the drop of a hat, then we deal with the leadership. The stats that i've found has 2005 looking at the avg class size @ 33.8 !? How is being essential services translate into being a "monopoly?" Quote:
I think at the end of the day; it is the responsibilty of the teachers union TOO strike, and ours to support them, and the government to legitemetly come to the bargaining table with a feasible negotiation. I completely agree with the notion that Union officials are part of the problem, and can say the same for HEU leadership, but as it right now, several striking union groups need to show solidarity, and we as young adults (me as the token geriatric) need to support our teachers.. because really at the end of the we as a "community" should be supporting the people, that spend more time with kids, then their parents do, and the people who wipe our asses, and clean up our puke when we are unable too(nurses). MAWO members will be joining up with various strike groups late this afternoon, ill try to post more details later. Can you suggest a good resource for more information on current union leadership in the teachers union and HEU?? peace+'spect fable
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Oct 11, 05
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Yeah, because all nurses do is clean up puke and wipe asses. What a waste of four years of university.
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And here's the regulatory body of Registered Nurses College of Registered Nurses of BC http://www.crnbc.ca/
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Oct 11, 05
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These stats are readily available on the Ministry of Education website.
If you agree that the union is corrupt and self-serving, how can you in good conscience support it? Quote:
Are you qualified to make such an assessment? Are you a civil servant who does this for a living? Have you analyzed the data? I suspect not. I suspect you are simply stating an opinion based on no facts whatsoever. Quote:
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Supporting them as a profession does not mean that I give teacher's carte blanche to do as they see fit. Nor does it mean that I (or my government) must grant every demand the BCTF brings forth. Frankly if any single teacher spends more time with a child than their parent, there is something wrong with that parent. Most teachers will see a student a total of 5-6 hours a week AT MOST. While I don't deny that teachers obviously have an interest in children, spending 6 hours a week with my child does not make any one of them the arbiter of what is good for my child. We have a ministry of education for a reason. Lastly I tend to largely ignore both union and government rhetoric. I suspect both of the unions you mentioned have a website and if you want biased self-serving information you should go there. I simply check the ministry numbers and make my own opinions.
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Oct 11, 05
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I forgot to address one of your points fable so here:
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You have it backwards. Teachers in the BCTF have a monopoly and therefore must come under essential service legislation. Starbucks isn't covered under essential service legislation because you can get a cup of coffee somewhere else. If teacher's strike, you cannot go somewhere else to get your child an education. Furthermore, taxpayers have no ability to stop paying taxes if they do not receive the services they are paying for (their child's education). To give the teachers the right to take that service away at any time is a slap in the face to any taxpayer. Does that make it clear? Last edited by Esoteric; Oct 11, 05 at 02:26 PM.
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