Serato Scratch Live SSL vs Traktor Scratch?

[Akeel]

Discuss.

[dj_soo]

serato:

- industry standard for digital vinyl control - likely if the club is going to have a permanent DVS setup, it's going to be an SL1 or a tm57
- proven via the test of time and sheer volume of users to be the most stable of the DVS systems
- best (imo) database management UI of all systems - Traktor's sucks.
- great UI in general
- doesn't have auto-beatmatching like traktor
- free upgrades of software (NI has been known to charge for upgrades)
- low system requirements - don't need to get a top of the line computer to run

traktor (never had hands-on experience with traktor skratch - just an old version of traktor, this is just from reviews and talking to actual users)

- more bells and whistles including 4 deck support (2 are virtual)
- built-in effects (only pre-fader effects tho)
- sound card is 24/96 while Serato is only 16/44
- allows for auto-beatmatching (depending on your stance, this is either good or bad)
- allows for full internal//midi-controller-only mixing. Serato has midi control, but still requires you to have a DJ mixer attached even if you only want to mix in the software

Those are the main differences that i can think of off the top of my head.

One thing is how much you need the extra features of Traktor. Both systems have a mode that allows for cue-points, loops, etc. but traktor has the bonus of internal effects. Of course, the more features that are implemented, the more things can go wrong too which is why some people are very happy with Serato's more basic features.

Also, if you don't cringe at the idea of auto-beatmatching (which personally i would never do), the 4-deck feature might be cool if you're into that kind of stuff (*cough* minimal techno djs *cough*).

Serato's library management is eons better than traktor tho hands-down... so if you're dealing with big libraries, that might actually sway you towards serato.

From a mixer perspective, Traktor has a sort of "traktor-compliance" mixer program going where a series of digital mixers can be plugged directly into your computer and give you full control over traktor scratch (i think the Korg line of mixers have this among others). For serato, you only have the option of the tm57 which, although it's an incredible mixer, may be too expensive for most.

As a working DJ, I'd recommend Serato just due to ubiquitousness of it being the industry standard and its solid reputation for stability. In addition, lot of clubs in vancouver are starting to include permanent installs of the SL1 box or the 57. That and I just really think it has the best UI out there...

Another thing - if endorsements matter at all to anyone - Scratchlive seems like much more of the choice for hiphop/multigenre DJs (although not exclusively) while traktor seems to be used more by primarily eletronic guys.

compare: ScratchLIVE.net · DJs using Scratch LIVE to NATIVE INSTRUMENTS : Products : Dj Line : Traktor Scratch : Artists

of course, your best bet is to try them out and decide for yourself. Granted, Serato will be easy to find... I don't know anyone in Vancouver that uses Traktor Scratch...

[dabbler]

/end of discussion?

[Ryan Ross]

really... what else is there to say?

[Drazkers]

Not much can be said, Soo did a great job above. Simply, if you want something that just allows you dj and will never fail then its Serato. If you want something with more Bells and whistles(audio routed directly into Ableton with Jack, 4 decks, ect.) then its Traktor. More features, less stability. That being said, the condition of your laptop is also more important then your DVS. Having a system with a good cpu(2 cores), decent ram(2gigs) combined with a clean partition without any extras or junk installed will eliminate 99% of problems.

I use Torq, generally accepted to have less stability then Serato. I use a clean partition and only browse about three thousand songs per sorted folder while spinning. Usually based on which genre or sub genre i'm playing with. By doing this I have had no crashes on the clean partition in eight months of using Torq. Have a friend, he is a great dj but has little to no computer knowledge outside of his known programs. He was having Serato crash alot until he set it up properly, he was blaming Serato when the real issue was he had so much crap and spyware running in the background.

[Revolver]

soo coined it perfectly from a professionals standpoint.

i can only offer my 'hobbyist dj' insights of wich ive been for exactly 10 years now(maybey i should start playing out now lol)..

I LOVE TRAKTOR. its LOADED to the tits with effects and various models of mixer eq's..its pretty full on. i use a bcd3000 to controll it and its just fucking deadly. took me while to learn how to spin those little wheels to cue and such but everything you need to mix is there.

love it!!! i even purchased and reg'ed a legit copy of it.

SERATO dosent have any of that awsome stuff and thats its greatest strength for sure. i used it alot at friends houses and am very impressed with its no bullshit approach and stability.

with bday money collected from various sources (LOL) im getting one in the next couple weeks and i cant wait. ill finally take out my turntables out from storage and get back into it all like i was years ago.

i think im going to use both in my system. my older ibook running the traktor 'controller' setup and my MPB running the serato 'vynl' setup....sweeeeeeet lol.:)

[dj_soo]

^ honestly, you'd probably be better off using the MBP to run Traktor and the older ibook on serato.

I forgot to mention, one of the big pros of serato is the low minimum system requirements to run which allows people to get started on even older laptops. Granted you need a little more horsepower to run some extra features but something like traktor scratch and torq are relative system hogs (partially due to all the extras added).

[Akeel]

great reply terrence!

I've been doing my own research for sometime and i've abandoned vinyl some time ago for cds...just the ease of bringing along one cd book and a scratch record is so much easier then lugging around a shitload of vinyl. I was pretty sure my next setup was going to be a new mac and serato, but i've been talking with General Midi and Autobotz who swear by traktor...botz using traktor studio with a midi controller, and midi using scratch live....whats held me back from serato is i've seen it crash several times over the years with friends of mine. Sometimes i think this was more of an issue with the equipment in the club then the laptop or serato. midi's been using scratch live for the last 8 months and hasnt had it crash on him yet. i love all the extra bells and whistles you get with scratch live, but i like to just plain mix records too. Torx is out of the running for me since i'm playing multiple genres these days and have a huge library.

so...........fuck i dont know which one to get.

balls.

[Kraig]

Akmeel... go with Serato bro. Especially for what I know you plan to use it for.

If you've not had a chance to play around with it, the program is free for download (full version) from the Serato site and borrow a friends Scratch Live box. Play with it for a week, mess around with the configuration, etc. so you can try before you buy.

Cheers.

[Akeel]

^
thanks for the idea Kraigbert!

i'm gonna have to do that soon - but i wanna be able to turn a knob and assign a bitcrusher to it even when i'm not playing on a djm-800!

[dj_soo]

Originally Posted by Akeel

great reply terrence!

I've been doing my own research for sometime and i've abandoned vinyl some time ago for cds...just the ease of bringing along one cd book and a scratch record is so much easier then lugging around a shitload of vinyl. I was pretty sure my next setup was going to be a new mac and serato, but i've been talking with General Midi and Autobotz who swear by traktor...botz using traktor studio with a midi controller, and midi using scratch live....whats held me back from serato is i've seen it crash several times over the years with friends of mine. Sometimes i think this was more of an issue with the equipment in the club then the laptop or serato. midi's been using scratch live for the last 8 months and hasnt had it crash on him yet. i love all the extra bells and whistles you get with scratch live, but i like to just plain mix records too. Torx is out of the running for me since i'm playing multiple genres these days and have a huge library.

so...........fuck i dont know which one to get.

balls.

I would recommend serato. If all you mainly want to do is plain mix records then go with the company that focuses mainly on that rather than the one that's trying to appeal to all the dj/producer types with all the extra effects and the like.

Also, I've been using Scratch Live for well over a year now and I've never had a crash. The worst thing that's happened is I've seen the program lock up a handful of times requiring a restart of the program, but the music kept playing in the background giving me time to throw on some backup media. Keep in mind this has only happened maybe 3 times in hundreds of gigs that I've been playing on scratch live. Also, for these issues, 90% of the time, it's due to user error (either bad setup or a corrupt file) and guaranteed that scratch live has more of the bugs worked out than Traktor just due to the time it's been around and the huge install base.

You have to keep in mind that NI also made Final Scratch which has affectionately been dubbed "Final Crash" has had issues where users were forced to pay to upgrade their software, and the software ended up not fixing known major issues. Granted, I heard that although the initial release of Traktor was chalk full of issues, subsequent upgrades have fixed most of them. However, given the comparatively smaller user base that traktor scratch has, you have to think there are still a lot of hidden problems that need to be flushed out (no QA team can match a massive user base)

Also, another advantage about serato is their customer support is simply amazing. If you have a question, jump onto their forums and just ask - usually, an actual employee will get back to you.

NI is your standard corporate system where you need to phone or e-mail customer support during open hours and you'll likely be connected to someone reading from a list of scripted standard answers...

Also, for your style of play, keep in mind that serato also supports midi controllers (although not quite so robust as traktor), so you could hook up a trigger finger, or your electronic hand drum and use that to control the software. Think about drumming out various cue points in your tunes in realtime while in the mix...

Basically I'd say - if you want to keep with DJing on turntables (or even using cdjs), stick with serato. If you've been considering going the all-midi-controller route, or really need the internal effects or 4 decks, go for traktor... just keep in mind that traktor is not as time-tested as serato...

[Kraig]

Originally Posted by Akeel

^
thanks for the idea Kraigbert!

i'm gonna have to do that soon - but i wanna be able to turn a knob and assign a bitcrusher to it even when i'm not playing on a djm-800!

You can do both bro.

And PS: I agree with everything Soo has said. Especially regarding crashes.

That time you saw it crash at KISS back in February was my own damn fault - the power cable came out of the external hard drive I was using at the time... again, my own fault.

I've used Serato with both control records and CDJ's... it's simply flawless. The que points and looping are damn handy too!

If you want to see some of the most advanced uses with Scratch Live, go watch Matt the Alien @ Shine. 57SL with foot pedals, effects and the whole nine.

[Akeel]

^^
that did it for me - serato it is...i've found most setups i'm dj'ing on these days always have 2 cdjs as well so I can use those for acapellas and the such.

[Akeel]

Originally Posted by Kraig

You can do both bro.

And PS: I agree with everything Soo has said. Especially regarding crashes.

That time you saw it crash at KISS back in February was my own damn fault - the power cable came out of the external hard drive I was using at the time... again, my own fault.

I've used Serato with both control records and CDJ's... it's simply flawless. The que points and looping are damn handy too!

If you want to see some of the most advanced uses with Scratch Live, go watch Matt the Alien @ Shine. 57SL with foot pedals, effects and the whole nine.

werd bro, hirsh and me where in the states and his serato wouldnt read the control vinyl on one side...fucked up and he had to tag because he could only play off one side of the setup. when we had quest out at shine, it crashed on him...luckily he's a bit paranoid and has entire library with him backed up on cds.

i wonder if serato plans on adding support for vsts...now that would be awesome.

[dj_soo]

Originally Posted by Akeel

^
that did it for me - serato it is...i've found most setups i'm dj'ing on these days always have 2 cdjs as well so I can use those for acapellas and the such.

to clarify: you can't assign a bitcrusher to a knob as serato does not have internal effects. If you get the 57 however, the mixer has effects setup (post-fader too) but... the layout isn't exactly the most user friendly.

personally i use an external fx box (efx-500) and found that works the best for me... if you want to check out the 57, you're welcome to come by my place too...

[rawb]

the effects on the 57 aren't really convenient or very good imo
still is a sick mixer

[Akeel]

^
sweet man thanks! i'll hit you up one of these weekends.

[dj_soo]

Originally Posted by rawb

the effects on the 57 aren't really convenient or very good imo
still is a sick mixer

they sound good - they're just not really conveniently laid out or user-friendly to use.

[rawb]

yeah i think that was more of what i was getting at

[Kraig]

Originally Posted by Akeel

werd bro, hirsh and me where in the states and his serato wouldnt read the control vinyl on one side...fucked up and he had to tag because he could only play off one side of the setup. when we had quest out at shine, it crashed on him...luckily he's a bit paranoid and has entire library with him backed up on cds.

i wonder if serato plans on adding support for vsts...now that would be awesome.

It wouldn't read the control vinyl? Well knowing Funkmaster Hirshel plays out a lot it was probably:
-- worn out control vinyl
-- a bad needle
-- seriously bad DJ setup IE: massive vibrations where the decks are setup, etc.

Easy way to get around this is to simply - bring 1 or 2 extra pieces of control vinyl and bring the digitally encoded CD's. I've played on the most bunk setups before where they've had horrible turntables/needles, etc. but had CDJ's of some kind - a quick cable from turntables to CDJ's on the Serato box, specify line vs. photo in my Serato setup and baam... I'm in business.

PS: almost every club in Vancouver has a built in Serato setup or is getting one they next time they refresh the DJ booth.

[Akeel]

what are the effects you get with the 57sl? it doesnt say on the rane site.

[dj_soo]

i mainly use the echo when i'm not using my efx, but off the top of my head it's got:

Echo (post-fader), Hold Echo (poor man's sampler), various filters (high pass, low-pass, mid pass) where you can adjust frequency and LFO and such and a "desecrator" which i think is a bitcrusher.

The effects are hardware so they are usable on any sound source and are available even without your laptop connected - but, the GUI is only in the software so if you want to use it w/o the laptop, you basically have to memorize the controls.

[omega_image]

The turntable not reading the Control Vinyl was probably due to faulty RCA's. My friend had this happen to him on only one of his tables, we switched everything, and eventually just replaced his RCA's with monster cables and that fixed the problem.

PS -we should get a 57 party going at Terrence's =)

[dj_soo]

for the vinyl not reading:

#1 cause - needle
#2 cause - faulty RCA connection

People should read the manual and learn to look at the scope view and learn what the signals mean.

[Kraig]

^^ Werd... you can all skool me on the embedded features of this mixer. I've only played out live on it 2 times. To expensive for clubs to purchase.