Quote:
Originally Posted by yoko*
Why call someone out on straying from the argument and making personal attacks when you're doing the same yourself?
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Yes it does take 2 to tango...perhaps it would've been better to have ignored them...but I never went out of my way to slam someone's thread that was heartfelt, I was just sticking up for myself.
Quote:
Originally Posted by yoko*
And no, your own personal attacks towards me did not prove any point except that it supported my hunch that your argumentative style is weak.
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So when I write something that may invalidate your earlier claims you just call it a personal attack and refuse to grapple wit...now
THAT is a weak argument.
Let's assume that you're right though and that they don't prove any points.
Why would you then ignore them?
Why not just go with them and allow my frivolous claims to be exposed?
Maybe it's that you didn't want to prove me right...that
you are the type of person that feels they can't control who they love. If that's the case, it's obvious why you didn't understand my original post, though maybe not to you.
Maybe the reason you and others took it so harshly is because you could be guilty of this very type of cynicism (you call it being a realist).
Taking a message that makes you face your demons is hard enough, but if you don't like the messenger, it's damn well near impossible, especially when there are others already pointing the finger.
It's far easier to just join in the mob, regardless if their point is valid, which I will prove isn't in the next paragraph.
***
You say I was looking down on anyone that disagreed with me, but how can you make such a claim when I consider all of us miracles in progress (including myself)? That puts us on equal footing. The idea that I am looking down on any of you is the sad excuse of your own cynicism that can't face it's own reflection.
What must have really got on people's nerves was the line saying where people have forgotten how to dream....people didn't understand what I meant by this, and instead of asking, extracted their own meaning.
Just so you know I'm attacking your argument and not your character at large, I earnestly thank you for at least attempting to debate the issue. Unfortunately you were unnecessarily hostile with me (not with your words, but your attitude) assuming I was gonna look down on you.
Quote:
Originally Posted by yoko*
The fact that you've made personal attacks and have also sent me bad karma** leads me to wonder whether you're really here to disucss a subject, or whether you're just here to try to impose your stubborn views upon others while rejecting any ideas that disprove or counter your own.
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Personal attacks? No I'm afraid not...enough with the hyperbole. If you want to focus that much on the negative aspects of this thread then it's no wonder why you said yourself why people call you a cynic.
I gave you bad karma for legendarily missing my point, it was a bit frustrating after you did all that writing, that you would ignore all that I wrote, or not get the sense of it.
As it stands, you haven't countered one of my points in response to what you wrote.
Quote:
Originally Posted by yoko*
To summarize,
Your arguments fail in that they deal with entirely abstract and subjective concepts. Abstract concepts such as 'cynicism' cannot be objectively identified within a population for many reasons.
- Firstly, because its identification depends on the one who is doing the identifying, the personal meanings that the identifier attaches to the concept will influence what the identifier deems "cynical".
- Secondly, the dictionary definition of cynicism is in itself broad and abtract, in that it cannot be easily separated from other similar concepts such as pessimism or depression.
- Lastly, it's one thing to distinguish a table from a chair, but a concept such as "cynicism" is a very abstract one which is in itself contextually created. Not all languages have an equivalent word for "cynicism". What I may perceive as cynical behaviour may be interpreted differently elsewhere.
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You make this needlessly complex when it doesn't have to be.
*ahem*
Cynicism: An attitude of scornful or jaded negativity, especially a general distrust of the integrity or professed motives of others.
It's really not as difficult as you're making it out to be. All I need to add to that definition is that the particular type of cynicism I am mentioning uses humor to mask it's negativity.
BOOM.
DONE.
Quote:
Originally Posted by yoko*
Since you fail to operationally define what cynicism is and how it can be identified or even distingushed and separated from other abstract concepts, the majority of your post dedicated to some abstract ideas about cynicism, especially those which address its measurement, are nullified. You can't measure what you can't define.
VV**
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I just defined it, and by default it is now separated by other abstract concepts, so it's your argument that's nullified.
Nov 17, 07
