Vancouver / Lower Mainland RCMP = Stone cold killers

[Billy Shears]

Referring of course to the recent story where they killed they guy at YVR with tasers, which then reminded me of a bunch of recent incidents..

Vancouver Taser tape released

RCMP punched, Tasered me: senior

Cops lose pay for drunken attacks

Exclusive: Mounties ordered to resign

Shot man had 'bipolar disorder'

Sudden Death [The Police Murder of Ian Bush from Houston, BC] | Mostly Water

Some stuff they get away with is nuts.

[KrisisID]

i saw that shit on the news man. so retarted.

[b0ld]

What do you expect from a criminal organization like the RCMP or the Police?. I mean after all they are now investigating another Criminal... Brian Mulroney... Criminals investigating criminals... Lets not forget the damning evidence of tapes that the rcmp recorded of conversations between organizers of the air india bombing... They just.. erased them... What about all the native men in manitoba that have been dumped in the freezing cold during winter on farm land only for them to freeze to death... Or how about Frank Paul who was dragged out of drunk tank because he was intoxicated but they left him out in the eliments outside during fall/winter time where he died of exposure, yet they tried to say that he was a victim of a hit and run incident?

[wishbone]

i thought this was a bold thread.....


edit:
spoke too soon.

^haha!

i was going to say.....

but further to this, and to be a productive member of the board.....

how much do you think the guy that sold the video to the press made?

[Digital Over]

^^^ Honestly, probably a fair bit, his motive was "The Public has a right to know" Granted, I hate to play a tad of a jadist here, some ppl can say just about anything, but I felt based on that statement, he seemed pretty honest about the whole thing....But the crap that guy had to go thru from the police w/ his footage and equipment is retarded....Police said "You have our word you'll have all of your footage back in 24 hours....48 hrs later, they responded with a sorry this is now our property." Wow, such bullshit....I heard this one ex chief or some ex high ranking officer say "Well it all happened so fast, how are you supposed to handle protocol that fast?" My response "training?" if the the squad really tightened that up as far as being able to properly follow thru with proper protocol, in a high stress situation...a death would have been prevented, the whole thing stinks....boo on you RCMP

[Billy Shears]

Originally Posted by Digital Over

I heard this one ex chief or some ex high ranking officer say "Well it all happened so fast, how are you supposed to handle protocol that fast?" My response "training?" if the the squad really tightened that up as far as being able to properly follow thru with proper protocol, in a high stress situation...a death would have been prevented, the whole thing stinks....boo on you RCMP

Basically what I got from that is that they are a bunch of pussies. 3 Police officers with clubs, tasers, and guns VS one agitated, bare-handed foreign guy. I can't believe they were so scared of the one guy that they resorted to using the taser at all.
"it all happened so fast"... what happened so fast? The police wetting their pants in fear?

Trigger happy pansies...

[mojo]

Any idea what caused him to become so emotional? It mentions him being told ot meet his mother, but it does not state why he did not pass customs.

Also....does anyone know if RCMP are taught CPR, and what their protocol is for performing it? I think their lack of immediate action is pathetic.

[P.A.R.T.Y]

The police in Vancouver are thugs. They illegally kick down doors and taser people. Enjoy the New World Order.

[Grapes]

Overreaction in this thread is on a comperable level to the overreaction of the police during the incident.

[mojo]

Originally Posted by mojo

Any idea what caused him to become so emotional? It mentions him being told ot meet his mother, but it does not state why he did not pass customs.

Also....does anyone know if RCMP are taught CPR, and what their protocol is for performing it? I think their lack of immediate action is pathetic.

YouTube - Taser Death by RCMP - commentary by filmer

they mention in this broacast that they are infact trained, and lead me to believ they had the authority to perform CPR. Also, that the VAA did not call for their own EMS crew, and that the BC Ambulance took 11mins to arrive.
That is fucking horrible. I am damn glad that it is getting such exposure....who knows what happened preceeding the footage but the actions by the cops afterwards is ridiculous to say the least.

[Billy Shears]

^
Seems like any 'training' they recieve goes out the window in real-life situations. (still laughing at the 'it all happened so fast' comment.. that's what frightened bystanders say, not police who should be 'in control' of the situation)

Obviously being a YVR cop obviously makes you soft and lazy. (or bored and starved for action)
Either they were bored (like many local law enforcement officers seem to be) and used the opportunity to play with their tasers, or they shit their pants in fear and didn't want to risk chipping a nail by detaining the guy with their bare hands (for fucks sake, even in the US the cops would have likely just beat his ass down with their fists and then thrown him in the paddy wagon).

[jenai]

nothing new: the State does manfacture criminals, and thus gangs.
domestic terrorism is when criminals terrorize the people
this is the bluest of blue collar crime.
State terrorism, when the State terrorizes the people
sometimes gangsters are even exported by other countries

only in an anarchy is it possible be free, not a democracy.

everywhere else, politicians just another bunch of criminals people elect and get their white collars dirty.

[jenai]

Argentina and Saharawi Arab Democratic Republic are one of a handful of anarchist states.

Zapatista is another.

[Grapes]

^ Sage??

[jenai]

what does 'sage' have to do with a better alternative to democracy?

we should be thanking David Cunningham instead of hating him.

though, he needs to take a vacation to Zapatista Land, Mexico on our tab to fix the drug problem in the Downtown Eastside!!!!!!!!!:idea:

[Alex]

Holy christ some of you people are ignorant and reactionary. The policer weren't at fault for what happened her, they followed protocol. Porotocol which statistically is the least harmful way to take an aggressive suspect down. Tasers are not usually lethal.

'Tasers are often used as an alternative to attacking the suspect with a baton or shooting him with firearms, both of which have a much higher chance of serious injury and death than the taser, even using the highest estimates of possible taser-related deaths.'

tasers are less likely to cause serious injury or death than a baton. Not to mention the fact that when considering the highest estimates, 'many of the deaths occurred in people with serious medical conditions and/or severe drug intoxication'

The fact is that Mr. Dziekankski(sp?) at the time was experiencing an adrenaline rush. This is the reason why he was acting so aggressively and irrationally. This is the reason he died. The amounts of adrenaline in his body were already greatly increasing his heart rate beyond normal levels, combined with the tasers his heart simply couldn't handle it and gave out. The police had no way of knowing.

Let's look at factors here.

1. Mr Dziekanski was waiting in customs for 15 hours. He was sleep deprived, confused, hungry, dehydrated and nicotine deprived.

-Where was his mother? Why was he waiting for 15 hours?

-Why was a translator not called at any point?

-Why, knowing that he'd been sitting for 15 hours, didn't anyone in customs or the airport in general offer him food or water?

These are all critical factors. Finally, regardless of circumstances, Mr Dzikanski was at an airport in customs. This is an international border. You do not behave in such a way at an international border crossing, regardless. I once sat at a US border crossing for 8 hours, because one of the members in our group failed to tell us he had a criminal record. I didn't have food or water or sleep either. Another time I sat for 5 hours trying to give a friend a ride to Seattle-he failed to mention he was attempting to get his US Green card on the way. Sure, it sucks, but you're in a foreign country. The americans shoot people trying to get into their country, as do other nations.

Granted their are probably aspects the police could have done slightly better, but in a situation like this so many contributed to being at fault, including mr Dziekanski. The media is blowing this up blaming police, because that's what the media does. Their is always only 1 side to a story, the side the media feels will get the best reaction and most emotional response from the large majority.

[guido]

considering he was contained and not harming anybody - in fact people were walking up asking him what was wrong - the cops didn't have to even take him down. they could have tried.. you know.... talking to him? i know he didn't speak english but putting their hands out in a non-threatening manner and at least attempting to calm him down may have helped. I also don't think multiple tazer shots were necessary. The first would have done the trick. Not that throwing chairs in anger is the best decision either, especially with cops present

Also, YVR cops are Richmond cops. The cops in richmond are here because they are not good enough to be vancouver cops. richmond is a suburb, all they have to deal with are splitting up parties, setting up road blocks, and pulling over people who's headlight is burnt out. Some of the cops here are cool and know what they're doing, but every officer I encounter is with at least one trainee in this city.

[jenai]

Originally Posted by guido

considering he was contained and not harming anybody - in fact people were walking up asking him what was wrong - the cops didn't have to even take him down. they could have tried.. you know.... talking to him? i know he didn't speak english but putting their hands out in a non-threatening manner and at least attempting to calm him down may have helped. I also don't think multiple tazer shots were necessary. The first would have done the trick. Not that throwing chairs in anger is the best decision either, especially with cops present

Also, YVR cops are Richmond cops. The cops in richmond are here because they are not good enough to be vancouver cops. richmond is a suburb, all they have to deal with are splitting up parties, setting up road blocks, and pulling over people who's headlight is burnt out. Some of the cops here are cool and know what they're doing, but every officer I encounter is with at least one trainee in this city.

i know conspiracy to harm someone when that guy is dead.
YVR needs real cops not useless rent a cops.

do cops make you feel safer now? or only when you are sober or not acting out as Robert was? basically the cops punished him for being a big baby.

isn't it that his mum's job?

[Alex]

^ Do you have a mental disability of some kind?

[b0ld]

I guess the rcmp doesn't learn... now there's an incident in chilliwack where they pepper sprayed, tazered, and used a baton on some guy... Now they are trying to figure out why he is in extremely "grave" condition..

[-evil-duerr-]

it's not the worse we've seen of the rcmp, but it's definitely been the most publicized as of late.


Wasn't it just last year or the year before that, where an RCMP shot a 15 year old kid in northern b.c. while in custody for public intoxication at a hocky game?

[Billy Shears]

Originally Posted by Alex

Holy christ some of you people are ignorant and reactionary. The policer weren't at fault for what happened her, they followed protocol. Porotocol which statistically is the least harmful way to take an aggressive suspect down. Tasers are not usually lethal.

You obviously know fuck-all about police protocol.

a) The police didn't talk to anyone in the area to figure out what was going on

b) The police didn't try to communicate with their victim at all, they just walked up to him and killed him. You don't just shoot and ask questions later.

c) the Polish dude was in a giant room by himself and didn't harm anyone at all. In fact, then they tasered him, he had his hands in the air and was backing away from them.

d) None of the police performed CPR on their dieing victim

Lets not forget all the lieing that the RCMP did.. First they said it was 2 officers, then 3 (without a shadow of a doubt), and finally they admitted to 4 when the tape went public (which almost didn't happen because they didn't want to give the tape back)... Why would they lie if they didn't fuck up and had nothing to hide?


You're right about some of that other stuff though.. YVR fucked up bad. The guys mom was looking for him and asking airport staff if he had come in yet, and they didnt help her at all. Also, there was supposed to be a translator for him, and she never showed up.

it's not the worse we've seen of the rcmp, but it's definitely been the most publicized as of late.


Wasn't it just last year or the year before that, where an RCMP shot a 15 year old kid in northern b.c. while in custody for public intoxication at a hocky game?

Yeah, you're right.. And they shot him in the back of the head, execution style. If you can find an article, I'll add it to the list :)

There's another incident from a couple years back where a few teenagers stole a minivan and took it for a joyride. When they were blocked off by the police, one RCMP officer emptied his clip of bullets into the windshield of the car. Miraculously he didnt kill any of the kids, but that's just fucked up.

[decypher]

Originally Posted by Alex

Holy christ some of you people are ignorant and reactionary. The policer weren't at fault for what happened her, they followed protocol. Porotocol which statistically is the least harmful way to take an aggressive suspect down. Tasers are not usually lethal.

'Tasers are often used as an alternative to attacking the suspect with a baton or shooting him with firearms, both of which have a much higher chance of serious injury and death than the taser, even using the highest estimates of possible taser-related deaths.'

tasers are less likely to cause serious injury or death than a baton. Not to mention the fact that when considering the highest estimates, 'many of the deaths occurred in people with serious medical conditions and/or severe drug intoxication'

The fact is that Mr. Dziekankski(sp?) at the time was experiencing an adrenaline rush. This is the reason why he was acting so aggressively and irrationally. This is the reason he died. The amounts of adrenaline in his body were already greatly increasing his heart rate beyond normal levels, combined with the tasers his heart simply couldn't handle it and gave out. The police had no way of knowing.

Let's look at factors here.

1. Mr Dziekanski was waiting in customs for 15 hours. He was sleep deprived, confused, hungry, dehydrated and nicotine deprived.

-Where was his mother? Why was he waiting for 15 hours?

-Why was a translator not called at any point?

-Why, knowing that he'd been sitting for 15 hours, didn't anyone in customs or the airport in general offer him food or water?

These are all critical factors. Finally, regardless of circumstances, Mr Dzikanski was at an airport in customs. This is an international border. You do not behave in such a way at an international border crossing, regardless. I once sat at a US border crossing for 8 hours, because one of the members in our group failed to tell us he had a criminal record. I didn't have food or water or sleep either. Another time I sat for 5 hours trying to give a friend a ride to Seattle-he failed to mention he was attempting to get his US Green card on the way. Sure, it sucks, but you're in a foreign country. The americans shoot people trying to get into their country, as do other nations.

Granted their are probably aspects the police could have done slightly better, but in a situation like this so many contributed to being at fault, including mr Dziekanski. The media is blowing this up blaming police, because that's what the media does. Their is always only 1 side to a story, the side the media feels will get the best reaction and most emotional response from the large majority.

Oh look at Mr. Policy here. I'd would sure name you to head the inquiry. The debate is about the use of tasers and it's effects. All the things you listed to do with his physical and mental state are factors that contribute to the danger of tasers, so in essence you are just proving our point.

You bring up the UN humanitarian principles on the use of force. How does a taser have less force then handling the man? Are these cops not trained to be in good physical condition and to be able to take down a man? Their are many other cases that prove that tasers are not always safe and safe use is contingent on many physical, mental and situational factors.

Throwing in how you had to sit in an airport once for a few hours and didn't get mad still doesn't negate that the airport wasn't equipped to handle foreign guests.