Jan 18, 07
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Jan 18, 07
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Jan 18, 07
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^Well if you have developed a set of rituals that establish meaning by staring at a blacklight then all the better for you. I was mainly using it as an example for what Mekim thinks ceremonies that involve Ibogaine or Ayahuasca equate to. I find it naive to trivialize cultural practices that have been a staple for many historical societies.
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Jan 18, 07
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how does a middle class suburnanite travelling to a third world country on a $1000+ plane ticket to take their drugs equate to the same thing as the shamens of that culture using these same drugs within their ceremonies to better communicate with their gods / elders / etc? where was i trivializing the culture and not simply the outsiders thinking they were part of it?
(heffy still ain't a playa)
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Jan 18, 07
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This is exciting Heffy way too much, I bet he jerks off to fnk.
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Jan 18, 07
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You still don't get it? Someone's status in society has nothing to do with what we are discussing. Shamanism is one of the earliest forms of communication. The Egyptian hierophant, the shaman, they were all specialists who imparted the knowledge they gained from these ceremonies to the community. It influenced art, astronomy and their religious beliefs. Your attempting to sway the argument away from your trivialization of the practice to trivialization of persons who take part in these ceremonies. The whole area of study is fascinating and certain people make great use of these healing plants that have proved to be beneficial. The link between the past and present users is the search for something more and the ability to communicate with the self in relation to the singularity. Just because someone is an "outsider" doesn't mean they can't appreciate the practices and go about it in a serious and academic fashion. Some travel half way around the world to eat McDonalds and snap a couple pictures. Some people travel around the world to be apart of something. Your inability to see the difference between someone who wants a high from mushrooms to watch movies and someone who goes through personal hell to break through the barriers of the mind is the point. I'm overstepping borders here though. The initial remark by you was obviously an attempt to trivialize something that was important to another person in an effort to make yourself feel better. You use ad hominem statements as an escape wrote from active discussion. /the end.
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Jan 18, 07
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ive sat in ceremony far up the ucalyi river where i was the only white surrounded by only locals.participated in many andean and quero rites,sat in ceremony with the gaurdian shaman of machu picchu, the only one who is allowed to practice at the site. its taken me two years of hard work and trial and error to seek out and learn from these experinces. and all on my own.things you cant really find in guidebooks. its not a case of me being a 'outsider' and 'thinking' that i am apart of it. I AM APART OF IT! i am a student of their traditions and healings. and i will be for the rest of my life. you indeed are, trivializing the entire culture by your reeking ignorance. again, i take no personal offence to anything that you say. but you must realize the entire subject gose far beyond your idea of mere shamanic tourisim. Last edited by Revolver; Jan 18, 07 at 06:37 PM.
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Jan 18, 07
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Jan 18, 07
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i always wondered what these shamans in south america must think of all these white bread north american college student types who are searching for some profound truth from a ceremony that isn't even part of their own religion or coulture.
just a thought.
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