McCain or Obama

[prozac]

Originally Posted by cubed

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zZJex9Ge2-Q

Win! I can't believe I just saw that. Welcome to the Presidency Mr. Obama.

[anewlife]

Originally Posted by dj_soo

sad to see all the yes's on gay marriage bans and abortion limits. I guess they're progressive enough to vote a black man as president but god forbid gay couple want to marry or women be allowed to do what they want to their own bodies.

agreed, Gay Marriage Bans Succeeding

[Grapes]

Did you guys want to start a different thread for that admittedly relevant issue? We have history being made over here.

Barack Obama greets his adoring supporters in Chicago | World news | guardian.co.uk

Photos: US election night victory celebrations around the world | World news | guardian.co.uk

[miss.myra]

Dave, we can't ignore the fact that some states don't feel that everybody is equal.

I truly understand the signifigance of Obama getting elected and appreciate it for what its worth, but a lot of those propositions people voted on don't truly say that America feels everyone is equal.

[dabbler]

I concur with Dave, different thread please.

[hardstylin]

theres way to much dumb in this thread

[dj_soo]

oh i'm sorry. am i bumming you out with the stark reality that america is still a discriminatory, intolerant, right-wing, overly religious, polarized country despite voting in a somewhat left of center president who happens to be half black?

I thought that much was apparent during the election itself. You realize Obama only won the popular vote by like 3% right? and it was only days ago where the ugly underbelly of america's racism was on full display...

[miss.myra]

Originally Posted by dabbler

I concur with Dave, different thread please.

oh ok, because blacks and hispanics in California voted for a black president because they believe in equality but voted to ban gay marriage because apparently equality doesn't extend to all types of people?

why talk about it somewhere else when it's all related?

[dabbler]

related does not mean same topic, but my bad I thought this was a topic of McCain vs Obama and the winner of the election.
American citizens (not the presidential candidates) still being discriminatory, intolerant, right-wing, and overly religious - could definitely make up an entirely new thread

[Erin]

Actually this thread is about who you would vote for. I would think that this thread can be about everything that was being voted on last night. After all, they all go together right?

[NinjaBoy]

Originally Posted by dj_soo

oh i'm sorry. am i bumming you out with the stark reality that america is still a discriminatory, intolerant, right-wing, overly religious, polarized country despite voting in a somewhat left of center president who happens to be half black?

I thought that much was apparent during the election itself. You realize Obama only won the popular vote by like 3% right? and it was only days ago where the ugly underbelly of america's racism was on full display...

Sadly I have to agree with this.

The fact that in much of the US race played an issue. I've even seen interviews where people complained Barack Obama wasn't an American enough name.

47% of the people voted for McCain, keep that in mind. He didn't really communicate a platform other then, "Don't trust that guy", yet he did come close in the popular vote. It was a platform of hate, and look how many American's bought into it.

This is a great victory, but America still has a way to go.

[diva]

Canada's perfect, though. We elected a guy who does believe that everyone's equal! Also, our politicians are very diverse and represent the diversity of our people!

[NinjaBoy]

Originally Posted by diva

Canada's perfect, though. We elected a guy who does believe that everyone's equal! Also, our politicians are very diverse and represent the diversity of our people!

Although not perfect, I believe the Canadian Elections are years beyond the American's current state.

From my experience, you don't have the same type of negative campaigning and blind hate that you do in the US system. The majority of Canadians actually have an understanding of the issues at hand, and vote for the issues at hand?

As for diversity, do keep in mind that we did briefly have a female Prime Minister over a decade before the American's got to this point.

It's safe to say, that race does not is not nearly the issue that it is in the United States. Racisim in Canada, is not near the level that American's face.

[diva]

Originally Posted by NinjaBoy

It's safe to say, that race does not is not nearly the issue that it is in the United States. Racisim in Canada, is not near the level that American's face.

I don't think it's safe to say that race is not nearly the same issue in Canada. Sorry. Canadians are just a lot more covert about their racism.

[Courtney]

Ninjaboy....you're wrong. I have many many sources to prove it.

[ebbomega]

^ Then why not cite them instead of just saying "you're wrong" and not contributing to the discussion?

[NinjaBoy]

Originally Posted by Courtney

Ninjaboy....you're wrong. I have many many sources to prove it.

Sure, lets see some :)

I expect at least half a dozen. And that you actually state your case.

[C_squared]

It was americas need for change to their health care, job prosperity and the dwindling economy that won this election for Obama. All this other racial shit ppl keep talking about is exactly what this "all eyes on the issue" gotcha media hype led you all to believe. The whole abortion issue is a dead horse and resuscitated by republicans as a wild card in political debate to throw democrats of their game. america is tired of hearing about the issues of abortion. the only issue is making it affordable for women to make that choice in america. the gay marriage thing will come with time, it was not an issue pressed for the reason that it could have alienated people in blue states and cost either party major votes. Obama played it safe and I'll admit neglected some key issues and rode the hopes of americans fueld by the economic downfall to a solid victory.

americans have a long way to go. Well the republican state of mind has a long way to go. As long as republicans use fear tactics like dirty campaigning, election rigging and manipulation of voters rights in strong republican strongholds it will be a realllllly long ride as that gap from the center will widen. In light of all this: Obama took back key states, this says a lot about americas willingness to change.

Obama is sitting on a $10 trillion deficit. The man played his game tight. And he has a lot of work to do. Give the race thing a rest.

BTW: Obamas speech was epic. YES THEY CAN!

[NinjaBoy]

Originally Posted by diva

I don't think it's safe to say that race is not nearly the same issue in Canada. Sorry. Canadians are just a lot more covert about their racism.

Hmm, this is pretty much impossible for me to argue. I can't read the minds of Canadians, I just go off of public incidents and groups that exist in Canada.

Although, I do find it hard to argue that the Southern states in the US haven't had clear cut examples of racism constantly.

An excellent example of American Racism vs Canadian Racism in the political system, is the "If Obama was won, could we still call it the white house?" buttons sold at Republican conventions.

I've lived both on the East Coast and West Coast of Canada, and have seen my share of racisim, yet I don't think it's fair to say Race plays as much of an issue in Canadian politics as it does in America.

[dj_soo]

Originally Posted by NinjaBoy

As for diversity, do keep in mind that we did briefly have a female Prime Minister over a decade before the American's got to this point.

that's hardly comparable - that was a position that resulted from Mulroney's retirement and was contested at the PC leadership convention. When the election actually was placed in the hands of the people, she didn't even win in her own riding. Now granted that had a lot to do with the collapse of the PC party and Mulroney's unpopularity itself, you can't really use Kim Cambell as some sort of progressive comparison to the states when the situations aren't even remotely similar.

[dj_soo]

Originally Posted by C_squared

It was americas need for change to their health care, job prosperity and the dwindling economy that won this election for Obama. All this other racial shit ppl keep talking about is exactly what this "all eyes on the issue" gotcha media hype led you all to believe. The whole abortion issue is a dead horse and resuscitated by republicans as a wild card in political debate to throw democrats of their game. america is tired of hearing about the issues of abortion. the only issue is making it affordable for women to make that choice in america. the gay marriage thing will come with time, it was not an issue pressed for the reason that it could have alienated people in blue states and cost either party major votes. Obama played it safe and I'll admit neglected some key issues and rode the hopes of americans fueld by the economic downfall to a solid victory.

americans have a long way to go. Well the republican state of mind has a long way to go. As long as republicans use fear tactics like dirty campaigning, election rigging and manipulation of voters rights in strong republican strongholds it will be a realllllly long ride as that gap from the center will widen. In light of all this: Obama took back key states, this says a lot about americas willingness to change.

Obama is sitting on a $10 trillion deficit. The man played his game tight. And he has a lot of work to do. Give the race thing a rest.

BTW: Obamas speech was epic. YES THEY CAN!

obama was smart to keep his distance from gay marriage - the country's not really ready for it yet and it would have cost him a lot of votes - it's just sad that prop 8 may pass (the no-ers haven't conceded yet) when california was supposed to be the one bastion of "enlightened" liberal folk.

[NinjaBoy]

Originally Posted by dj_soo

that's hardly comparable - that was a position that resulted from Mulroney's retirement and was contested at the PC leadership convention. When the election actually was placed in the hands of the people, she didn't even win in her own riding. Now granted that had a lot to do with the collapse of the PC party and Mulroney's unpopularity itself, you can't really use Kim Cambell as some sort of progressive comparison to the states when the situations aren't even remotely similar.

Honestly, I will give you that, and Kim Cambell's rise to PM seemed more like a "Hey world, we're progressive" on her own she didn't have any merit.

[diva]

It's completely normal to get defensive when someone suggests that the society we live in is still very much racist, and not nearly as progressive as it would like to pass itself off as being.

I've lived both on the East Coast and West Coast of Canada, and have seen my share of racisim, yet I don't think it's fair to say Race plays as much of an issue in Canadian politics as it does in America.

^But it's kind of weird that you'd only use your frame of reference when trying to prove your point.

I've lived both on the East Coast and West Coast of Canada, and have seen my share of racisim, yet I don't think it's fair to say Race plays as much of an issue in Canadian politics as it does in America.

Are you talking about racism in general, or racism in politics? Because your previous statement didn't indicate that you were making a reference to the political process...

Originally Posted by NinjaBoy View Post
It's safe to say, that race does not is not nearly the issue that it is in the United States. Racism in Canada, is not near the level that American's face.

[diva]

Originally Posted by dj_soo

that's hardly comparable - that was a position that resulted from Mulroney's retirement and was contested at the PC leadership convention. When the election actually was placed in the hands of the people, she didn't even win in her own riding. Now granted that had a lot to do with the collapse of the PC party and Mulroney's unpopularity itself, you can't really use Kim Cambell as some sort of progressive comparison to the states when the situations aren't even remotely similar.

Yeah, I couldn't really figure out why he used her as an example of how progressive Canadians are when it comes to electing politicians... I mean, China had a female head of state long before we ever did, but no one would use them as an example.

[dj_soo]

could mention margaret thatcher too