How much are you worth per hour?

[Alex]

I had a long response posted but after reading it their are some things I don't wish to share. You think I've been given opportunities? I started from the bottom. I started poor, with poor parents. I worked hard; damn hard, and took risks. That's what it takes to succeed. I've failed, and had to start from scratch. I haven't turned for help. I run my own business, and several times I've had to take a 2nd FULL TIME job to not only keep my business afloat, but pay my bills- living damn frugally might I add.

My point is that we live in a society in which NO MATTER what type of ethnic background or upbringing an andividual has had, it is possible to succeed. Do you have to work hard? usually, yes. Do you have to take risks? Of course. But the opportunities are out their. Life is nothing but a matter of choices. Some choose to work hard, to motivate themselves(motivation is a LEARNED SKILL) and have the drive and desire to achieve. Others play the victim card, let their fears, emotions, and problems eat away at their sanity and confidence in life. If someone in Canada has let themselves fall to the point of homelessness, they are a loser in life. Either they have taken risks and crumbled under the pressure, used drugs to escape their reality, or just never tried. regardless what the situation leading up to their current condition, they have failed at life, and failed humanity.

[kir mokum]

i never said you were lazy. and yes, it is possible for anybody to succeed. i never said it wasn't, but it's not an even playing field. there are inequalities. lots of inequalities. and there's a big fucking difference between "possible" and "likely".

just because you started "poor" doesn't mean you didn't have opportunities. the fact that you are where you are strongly suggests to me that you've had many opportunities.

and the homeless haven't "failed life" or "failed humanity". usually humanity has failed them. usually it's not just humanity either. usually it involves a long string of really, really shitty luck and a fuckload of other things.

i think it's great that you feel successful and that you've succeeded in the uphill struggle and that you're making a good living now. but no everyone is you (not everyone has their finances as a priority). your story is an exception. maybe you should keep that in mind the next time you think of the less fortunate. imagine trying to do what you did if you had a history of massive alcoholism, mental illness, shit luck, and being an indian with FAS. there's a lot of doors that close really fast when you're not a white male and the struggle gets a lot harder.

Originally Posted by Alex

I had a long response posted but after reading it their are some things I don't wish to share. You think I've been given opportunities? I started from the bottom. I started poor, with poor parents. I worked hard; damn hard, and took risks. That's what it takes to succeed. I've failed, and had to start from scratch. I haven't turned for help. I run my own business, and several times I've had to take a 2nd FULL TIME job to not only keep my business afloat, but pay my bills- living damn frugally might I add.

My point is that we live in a society in which NO MATTER what type of ethnic background or upbringing an andividual has had, it is possible to succeed. Do you have to work hard? usually, yes. Do you have to take risks? Of course. But the opportunities are out their. Life is nothing but a matter of choices. Some choose to work hard, to motivate themselves(motivation is a LEARNED SKILL) and have the drive and desire to achieve. Others play the victim card, let their fears, emotions, and problems eat away at their sanity and confidence in life. If someone in Canada has let themselves fall to the point of homelessness, they are a loser in life. Either they have taken risks and crumbled under the pressure, used drugs to escape their reality, or just never tried. regardless what the situation leading up to their current condition, they have failed at life, and failed humanity.

pretty easy to pigeon hole a group of people you know nothing about. i dont often repost an argument, but you have this idea that most of the homeless got there because of something they did. most of the people that are homeless in this city is due to disability or mental illness.

so my cousin, who has schizophrenia, who watches the tv from outside the house so that the tv can't watch him because he doesn't know any better deserves a sub-par lifestyle because he doesnt know any better?

he often goes of his meds, as many schizophrenics do because they think think they are cured(just another part of the disease), and he ends up in less than favorable conditions. he is fortunate and has a family that cares for him but many of the schizophrenics in this city dont.

many of the homeless in vancouver suffer from mental disease. their homes like woodlands and riverview have been closed due to budget cutbacks. as a result, they end up on the street and turn to drugs.

please enlighten me how this is their fault and how they arent victims of circumstance.

[wigglesworth]

This is the last 4 months of work for me.

[impure]

Originally Posted by G3N3R4L

how many people think they are overpaid for what they do?

when i worked as the placing judge at hastings i think i was a bit over paid.
i got a little over $14/hr and spent at least 1/3 of my time sitting around reading or fucking around in the jocks room eating their food and watching tv.

[impure]

Originally Posted by Avana

pretty easy to pigeon hole a group of people you know nothing about. i dont often repost an argument, but you have this idea that most of the homeless got there because of something they did. most of the people that are homeless in this city is due to disability or mental illness.

so my cousin, who has schizophrenia, who watches the tv from outside the house so that the tv can't watch him because he doesn't know any better deserves a sub-par lifestyle because he doesnt know any better?

he often goes of his meds, as many schizophrenics do because they think think they are cured(just another part of the disease), and he ends up in less than favorable conditions. he is fortunate and has a family that cares for him but many of the schizophrenics in this city dont.

many of the homeless in vancouver suffer from mental disease. their homes like woodlands and riverview have been closed due to budget cutbacks. as a result, they end up on the street and turn to drugs.

please enlighten me how this is their fault and how they arent victims of circumstance.

ooo that reminds me of the movie A Beautiful Mind.
what a great story.

[Senior]

Originally Posted by kir mokum

sure, some people fail up and some people fight fairly to the top, so to speak. i didn't say intelligent skilled people couldn't be successful or that when they are successful it's not because of their skills or intelligence. what i am saying is the whole idea that capitalism (and especially the forms of capitalism we're familiar with) is fair or egalitarian or that people are only limited by their skills and/or intelligence is a total load of horse shit and is by definition propaganda.

but you're right in that success is a very complicated thing.

oh, i see where the confusion came into play: you thought i was using "you" in a "pluralis majestatis" way. i was actually referring to alex specifically.

no I was definitely aware that you were talking about Alex, who has once again proved to be a pompous asshole. and no system is completely egalitarian as some people might like to think.

[Senior]

SERIOUSLY AVANA YOU GOT TO TELL YOUR COUSIN JUST QUIT BEING LAZY WORK HARD AND BIG THINGS WILL HAPPEN YOU JUST FOLLOW THESE 8 EASY STEPS EVEN FROM OUTSIDE HOUSE YOU CAN WATCH MY NEW DVD EXPLAINING ALL OF THIS THEN IN 6 QUICK MONTHS HE COULD DRIVE ANY CAR HE WANTS SEE ALL THE NICE CARS I DRIVE?

Originally Posted by Avana

pretty easy to pigeon hole a group of people you know nothing about. i dont often repost an argument, but you have this idea that most of the homeless got there because of something they did. most of the people that are homeless in this city is due to disability or mental illness.

so my cousin, who has schizophrenia, who watches the tv from outside the house so that the tv can't watch him because he doesn't know any better deserves a sub-par lifestyle because he doesnt know any better?

he often goes of his meds, as many schizophrenics do because they think think they are cured(just another part of the disease), and he ends up in less than favorable conditions. he is fortunate and has a family that cares for him but many of the schizophrenics in this city dont.

many of the homeless in vancouver suffer from mental disease. their homes like woodlands and riverview have been closed due to budget cutbacks. as a result, they end up on the street and turn to drugs.

please enlighten me how this is their fault and how they arent victims of circumstance.

[ebbomega]

Originally Posted by Alex

*snip*

I love it when white males try to argue that it's a level playing field. Kind of like watching someone who doesn't grasp quantum physics trying to argue that string theory is a bunch of bullshit.

Originally Posted by Senior

SERIOUSLY AVANA YOU GOT TO TELL YOUR COUSIN JUST QUIT BEING LAZY WORK HARD AND BIG THINGS WILL HAPPEN YOU JUST FOLLOW THESE 8 EASY STEPS EVEN FROM OUTSIDE HOUSE YOU CAN WATCH MY NEW DVD EXPLAINING ALL OF THIS THEN IN 6 QUICK MONTHS HE COULD DRIVE ANY CAR HE WANTS SEE ALL THE NICE CARS I DRIVE?

pretty sure no one will employ him, his favorite hat is a pencil case. :(

[impure]

Originally Posted by ebbomega

I love it when white males try to argue that it's a level playing field. Kind of like watching someone who doesn't grasp quantum physics trying to argue that string theory is a bunch of bullshit.

it makes you wonder if they've ever seen outside of their cubicle.

[wishbone]

Originally Posted by ebbomega

I love it when white males try to argue that it's a level playing field. Kind of like watching someone who doesn't grasp quantum physics trying to argue that string theory is a bunch of bullshit.

but the surfer dude said the E8 thing is better than string theory :(

[ebbomega]

Originally Posted by wishbone

but the surfer dude said the E8 thing is better than string theory :(

Yeah, but it does nothing to disprove it.

[SEAN!]

Originally Posted by OsmosisJones

OK, "the man" part is cheesy, I was going for a bit of sarcasm, which is hard online. Still, could'nt the taboo on not talking about our wages be a bit of social control we put on ourselves? The fact is, money is one of the biggest factors in everyones life, and it's kind of strange we don't like to talk about it. When I'm making good money and someone asks me about my salary, it makes me feel uncomfortable, and when I'm making crap money it does'nt bother me at all....Kinda ties in with what Decypher said about money creating boundries I guess

another interesting discussion would be regarding what people cosider to be a good wage or salary. everyone's expectations are different, some may think 60 or 70 tousand a year to be alot while some people think otherwise.

[jenai]

$50 an hour as graduate of CDI Surrey in computer maintenance (software and minor hardware) with specialization in Linux since 2003 and exclusively Ubuntu Linux since 2006.

While I didn't take the A+ test due to financial difficulties, I have experience in Unix since about 1992 while on wimsey.com

Prior to that, I am experienced on 8-bit computers, with ML experience on 6502-based and 6809-based systems. My original computer was a Timex Sinclair kit that never worked. My first computer was the Commodore Superpet.

I also have evolved from Commodore 64 modemming in 1985 to cellphone text messaging today.

[SEAN!]

oh no i agree with alex and kir mokum, does that mean im a flip flopper?

as an aside i dont agree completely with either. life is nothing but a set of probabilities certain exogenous factors influence your life in ways you dont have control over. life is not a formula working hard and making the 'right' choices does not result in success, there is an element of chance 'luck' involved. secondly i dont think gender or ethnicity play as much a role as some think. to succeed in business you need to be able to perform, it is very meritocratic because they only see green . i think where alot of inequality stems from is how soceity socializes indivuals based on what role children are expected to take which is dependant on there gender cultural and socioeconomic orgins. there are attributes that influence how successful you are going to be but they arent intrinsic to what gender or race you are, it just seems like society likes to reinforce stereotypes by producing individuals and children to fit these roles.

[Courtney]

I'm priceless baby!

[EcsOTK]

i work at a restaurant part time as a chef and i get 13 an hour

[Lil Jenna]

Originally Posted by *SunShyne*

Lil Jenna - no more than $14 hourly, and that's if you had previous experience.

Really?

The last office I was working at I started at $17. By the time I quit I was making $18.85. Doing a lot less than I am where I am working currently.

And I wasn't there for long. But at that time I was over paid.

[ebbomega]

Originally Posted by jenai

While I didn't take the A+ test due to financial difficulties, I have experience in Unix since about 1992 while on wimsey.com

1) How is it that someone making $50/hour can't afford a $200 test?
2) Really, most employers don't really care about certs. Experience is a lot more valuable. Only cert I can think of that would get you a job where you wouldn't have without one is Cisco. If it's really imperative to get certified, most employers would just put you through the course if they like you.

[OsmosisJones]

Originally Posted by SEAN!

another interesting discussion would be regarding what people cosider to be a good wage or salary. everyone's expectations are different, some may think 60 or 70 tousand a year to be alot while some people think otherwise.

I think $20 an hour is a good wage if you work full time. Its not tons, but its enough for do do almost anything you want if you budget right.

[MissBehavior]

Originally Posted by Avana

pretty easy to pigeon hole a group of people you know nothing about. i dont often repost an argument, but you have this idea that most of the homeless got there because of something they did. most of the people that are homeless in this city is due to disability or mental illness.

so my cousin, who has schizophrenia, who watches the tv from outside the house so that the tv can't watch him because he doesn't know any better deserves a sub-par lifestyle because he doesnt know any better?

he often goes of his meds, as many schizophrenics do because they think think they are cured(just another part of the disease), and he ends up in less than favorable conditions. he is fortunate and has a family that cares for him but many of the schizophrenics in this city dont.

many of the homeless in vancouver suffer from mental disease. their homes like woodlands and riverview have been closed due to budget cutbacks. as a result, they end up on the street and turn to drugs.

please enlighten me how this is their fault and how they arent victims of circumstance.

This is what I was going to say, but I just had to quote this because you're far more eloquent that I would have been.

[SEAN!]

Originally Posted by OsmosisJones

I think $20 an hour is a good wage if you work full time. Its not tons, but its enough for do do almost anything you want if you budget right.

can't buy a ferrari on 20 bucks an hour.

[Gusto]

Originally Posted by jenai

While I didn't take the A+ test due to financial difficulties, I have experience in Unix since about 1992 while on wimsey.com

why would you want it anyway? it's the bottom rung of certifications. i'd sooner hire someone that didn't take A+ because they don't need it than someone who took it to try and prove he knows something.

[robyn]

Originally Posted by SEAN!

can't buy a ferrari on 20 bucks an hour.

can't buy a house on 20 bucks an hour. 40k/year. dream big!