Apr 24, 03
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Apr 24, 03
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woman. are you dense?
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Apr 24, 03
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somebody should tell courtney to peruse this..
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Apr 24, 03
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Apr 24, 03
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I THINK THAT PLAZA IS RIPPER MOST OF THE TIME, WHEN THE VIBE IS GOOD ANYWAY, I DO AGREE WAY TOO MANY YOUNG KIDS AT TWISTED THIS YEARS. I HATE PARTYING WITH THEM. IM WILLING TO DO IT AS LONG AS THEY KEEP BRINGING PHAT HEADLINERS TO THE MAIN TRANCE STAGE AND KEEP THE MUSIC HARD IN THE MORNING, WHICH THEY SEEM TO NEVER DO. ANYWAYS SEE YA IN THE MIDDLE OF THE TRANCE STAGE
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Apr 25, 03
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Goat: I've said this before, i am not gonna hate on you for being a newbie to the rave scene, i think thats totally cool and everything... but here, in a very to the point statement = Do not come on here preaching that plur shit...
P.S. Plur should be shortened to R for Respect
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Apr 25, 03
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Oh god, way too much to read.
Ravers have always been a mixture of younger and older people. The young replace the old (naturally) with time. The old complain that there are more younger people than before (naturally). etc. etc. etc. the young support the drugs, the old dis the young ones (although there may only be a few years of separation). People will do their drugs wherever they can. It's like smoking pot. It's ok doing it alone, but when you do it with a bunch of people (especially at a rave), the sesh is a lot more enjoyable. Just give someone an excuse to have a good time in a city where there really isn't anything to do, and eventually the guys who do shrooms or smoke a joint before a movie will go to a rave to have a good time. If someone dies of e, or a shroomy seizure in a theater, will you deem silver cities unsafe? i've smoked many a joint before movies. are they safe havens or sesspools of evil, hate, racism, drugs, sex, and violence that you're making raves out to be? i've done a whole lot more awful things inside theaters than inside raves. i guess we'll have to set up medical stations in theaters to compensate for the turn over. hrmm... guilty by association. sucks.
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Apr 25, 03
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hmmm...I guess I might as well throw in my two cents.
1) About the girl ODing... It is sad that it happened to someone so young. We all do stupid things when we are younger. I am no exception. I feel bad for the girl and I hope she gets better. BUT it was her decision to do drugs and to do that amount. No one put a gun to her head. No one made her do it. After all, everyone knows that drugs are bad for you. We see it constantly in the media from the time we can crawl. We do it the first time for the thrill of doing something that is "taboo" and we KNOW it can hurt us. It would be like driving without a seatbelt or skateboarding without a helmet, maybe something bad will happen maybe something won't but you know the risks of doing it. 2) About Plaza... I personally don't like the plaza because people I find are really inconsiderate (ie: sitting in the center of the dancefloor) and the tickets are overpriced. But then again I don't really like the majority of the scene in vancouver. (It is pretty weak and most people seem to cop some elitist attitude which is utter bullshit and there is never any room to dance). BUT I don't think that the venue should be shut down because someone hurts themselves at it. Plaza promoters do security checks at the door, they provide first aid, you have access to water and food if you need it. All these things are done to promote safety at parties. YES the crowd is younger. The reason why you probably don't see those ods at smaller parties is because people there have been doing drugs for awhile and when they do do them, they know their limits. SO in conclusion: The plaza (even though it draws a younger/older/sketchier crowd), should not be shut down just because someone made a stupid decision.
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Apr 25, 03
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I actually agree w/ lildonkey here, you should keep that shit to yourself.
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Apr 25, 03
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So about this respect for drugs thing... I totally disagree with what most of you are saying.
I have NO respect for drugs. They ruin people. They turn even the strongest individual into their slave. Anything that can affect a person so much that they will compromise their morals just to have a good time, that encourages dependancy and weak-mindedness, that breaks apart families and relationships, does NOT deserve any respect in my books. Oh and we all know that drugs can kill you. Would you respect the man holding a gun to your head? Or the drunk driver that kills your sister? And I really lose respect for the people that selfishly ignore the consequences of drugs just so they can get that short feeling of bliss.
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Apr 25, 03
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You don't have to respect the person pointing a gun to you head but you have to give that person a bit respect or else you will aggrevate them enough to pull the trigger. There is a subtle difference here. Comparing drugs to a drunk driver is not equal either. A drug just sits there and does not have any influence whatsoever on the outcome of your life, my life or anyone else life as long as it just sits there. A drunk driver is a person that has made a conscious decision to get behind a wheel of a car while intoxicated and start moving. This person now controls their own destiny and that of others. A drug has no ability to make a decision, but a person does though. I understand your point of view in not liking the term "repsect for drugs" but I feel that too many people take a drug/chemical for granted and not understand the true potential of it to really do damage and therefore decide to indulge in excess. For example, we take Tylenol/Aspirin/Ibuprofen all the time to take away our aches and pains but somehow many of us know NOT to take more than the recommended dose. Why? We were taught to respect the drug and that we may have a bad effect if we don't adhere to the recommended dosages. So what makes taking these drugs different than any other drug like E? You don't hear people freaking out over people that overdose on a bottle of Tylenol Extra Strength, Sleeping Pills or Centrum Multivitamins. It is not like it can't happen, there is enough of whatever in those bottles to cause some damage or kill you. It is because we give it "respect" and we follow the guidelines on the bottle. Sure Ecstacy might not come in a bottle with warnings and recommended dosages on it but give me a break... taking multiple dosages of a chemical that you have no idea what it contains or what it can do to your body is just silly. I am not saying who is right and who is wrong in this situation, but a teenager that is in the hospital from a poor decision she made. We all make them in our lives, but the point I am trying to pass on is that when we look at drugs as something less than what they are and lose the respect for what they can do, then we deserve the consequences of our actions.
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Apr 25, 03
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Miska, I think you’re missing the point when we say to respect drugs.
It's not like we're saying respect drugs like you would a person. What I mean anyway is respect the power it can have over people's lives, respect that they are not something to play w/ or take lightly. Don't take their power for granted. It's kind of like when people say to respect the elements. And again, drugs don't just walk into people’s bodies. People make the choice to do them on their own.
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Apr 25, 03
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You know fucking NOTHING. Do me a favour and quarantine yourself so you don't infect the rest of us with the stupid, ok? Sure, it's stupid to be fifteen and doing drugs, but you know what, a lot of us have done it. And, ooh, guess what.. a lot of us have STOPPED doing it, too. Just because you've popped a few times, or maybe even a few dozen times, doesn't mean your life is inevitably going to fall apart. People fuck themselves up, then sort themselves out. Duh? This shouldn't have happened, but it's really hard to know how to gauge your 'limit' when so much conflicting information is spread around within the media, certain social circles, school, etc.. What one 'reliable source' will tell you regarding substance use, another person will completely disagree with. And, of course, their opinions are both right. Buddy, she may not LIVE to 'think twice' about doing drugs. Have a fucking heart. Not everything is black&white, polar opposite style. Sure, she should have researched, she should have known better, but.. she didn't. A lot of people SHOULD have done a lot of things, but that's not the way it works. Now she's on life support in the hospital. Seems most of you don't understand how precious life is eh? When a smoker dies from cancer, is it any less sad? When someone dies from drug abuse? Think a little, you don't know how things are going to turn out. Myself, I've been lucky.. but I'm sure for a lot of you things could have fucked up majorly if the circumstances were a little different. -Claire
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Apr 25, 03
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omg. that was lots of reading.
and to be honest, only a handful of the people that responded to this post had something valid and coherent to say. the rest just seemed like jibberish that you decided to spew out in order to "have an opinion". direct it somewhere courtney. and it's good to hear she's doing better. [not bragging or anything] i used to be a part of something called "rave safe" in calgary when i lived there. an affiliation of dancesafe actually. maybe it would be wise for something like that to start up here? i am offering a link to someone that knows. if anyone's at all interested. (*hint, this is for all you people out there that are big on knowing what you're doing and taking and preaching, and tell others to do something about it.) when i was a member, and in fact a public relations admin.and secretary, i came across numerous situations. some like this, and others (most) not so severe. but we were there, and i'm confident that we helped reduce situations like this from happening. the biggest thing. most people don't know what the hell they're doing. and it's a shame that there's nothing like rave safe here to help educate those that choose to partake.
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Apr 25, 03
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I dunno my whole point is that just because something is powerful and scary, doesn't mean it deserves respect.
my whole take on this is different from all of you because i don't do drugs and i never have (well chemicals..). i don't even take tylenol and i stay away from medication if i don't think its totally necessary because i dont like putting unnatural substances into my body. winston, in response to your post, how is comparing a drunk driver with drugs not equal? do you not consider alcohol a drug? they all affect your personality and your decisions, no matter what kind. you can't sit there and say that drugs don't affect your choices. think of our 007 buddy. being wise about your drug choices doesn't necesarily mean you have respect for drugs, it just means you're not stupid.
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Apr 25, 03
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What I was trying to say is a drug by itself can do no harm unless it is taken. A drunk driver ingested alcohol take out a tree, themselves or god forbit an innocent bystander, "007" thought he could clear the jump due to some mushrooms and I thought I was the Eneergizer Bunny. What went through our minds at that moment in time I have no idea. Realize that a person is 100% clear in their mind BEFORE they decide to ingest any drug or substance, any decision they make afterwards is obviously questionable. I'm not going to sit here and state otherwise as I have been in both situations, but I have limits that I put in place to make sure nothing crazy happens to myself. Being wise about you drug choices inherently means you respect the possibility that doing too much of the drugs (or anything) at one time can fuck you up permanently. Respect it and do it in moderation if you choose to do it is the point I was trying to convey. That is what I tried teach in the old days of F&K if you look in the archives, but it seems the "new" group of partykids don't care to learn before they do, think they are invincible and some will have to suffer the consequences because of it.
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Apr 25, 03
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With all due respekt to the E casuality, this unfortunate situation is just further evidence of the uselessness and "cultural redundency" of ....ahem...."raves". Its not a safe business venture for venues, promoters, let alone for audiences, and besides, RAVING is hardly cultured in 2003. Dance music CAN survive elsewhere, and IS. Just look around. If you're all soooo "down with the scene and each other", bring the scene into safer hands. DO SOMETHING DIFFERENT. Create a different environment and culture around this 'plur' bullshit. And has CONSUMERS, be more careful what u support.
pfft..."raving" - the rest of the dance music industry has moved on...why cant' u?
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Apr 26, 03
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seeeeriously, i dont kno where to start in this thread. maybe i should just stay out of it since anyone who says anythin gets flamed or ranted on cuz of their opinion. well maybe thats why there are things like these threads to vent ur opinions.
about this. well its kinda the kids fault, we dont kno if she got her drugs there, where its like a freakin russian roulette game wen u dont kno who ur gettin it frum rite, or if she got it frum a friend or a connection where the guy wanted to make a pretty penny. but hey, ur 15, dont kno shit, hella young tryin shit out rite. u learn things frum experience altho no one wants to learn the way she did. the other blame i put it on is the cops. i do agree with form, wen ur under the influence of any drug u do get taht paranoia rite. ur heart beats a little faster wen u do see the pigs, think they are out to get u, so u hav that thought in ur mind like oh no! im fucked! wen ur 15 and prolly never had that feeling before at a RAVE also and not used to it rite its a new feeling add the drugs it will fuck u up. i bet u if someone, say they were like 25 or sumthin and that happened to them they could handle it cuz 1 theyve prolly been thru it b4, 2 theyre old enuff that they dont care their parents kno, 3 thy would kno who they go their drugs frum and learnt frum experiences and such. im so-so on the age limit thing. if its like ur first rave or ur young, go with someone who knows the ropes cuz guaranteed if u hear about raves and are intrigued by it, someone must hav told u about it. so them sayin to close plaza is bullshit or wherever that rumor is floatin around, jus b more careful wen tryin out the rave scene and do kno the consequences if u dont know wtf ur doin. but i guess the newbies now will know frum this experience so i guess it did teach a lesson. and if not, then well shitty for u.
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Apr 27, 03
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As far as I see it I dont really like the plaza all that much but without it the Vancouver electronic scene would be crippled.
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